Cannot restore backup (SonicTransporter)

Same here. It might not only be a Roon but also/or a SonicTransporter issue!
That’s why I flag at both now @support and @agillis.

Hi @R1200CL and @NOA ----- Thank you both for the report(s) and continued feedback, my apologies for the slow response here.

Moving forward, I would like to get this report over to our tech team along with a set of your Roon logs so the team can have a closer look into this behavior you both are experiencing while trying to restore from a backup. With the above in mind may I very kindly ask you for the following:

  • Please provide very brief, but accurate description of your current setup

  • Please gather a set of your Roon logs from the ST using the instructions found here. They can be sent to us via a “shared dropbox link” or another upload method of your choosing.

Many thanks!
-Eric

So I did the test as explained. A virgin installation of Roon in my Qnap got a fresh backup from today from my working SonicTransporter i5. The restore process goes thru, but has no value, as no audio devices can be shown at all. This also happened with an old restore to my SonicTransporter.

Also even if my Tidal account seems to be working, noting is happening there as well, Zero import.
I removed the shared folder reference in storrange as those where not working either, and added the local folder off the Qnap.
No reaction. Fores rescan do not solve the issue.

Further it is not possible to open the import settings.

In general the windows app of Roon is very slow at startup and freeze in the beginning. And it denies to close as well.

@crieke
For some strange reason the Roon icon disappears for the main screen in Qnap, and is only available under app center. (I’m aware the settings option, but those settings is not related to main menu) .
EDIT: I just found you I can create a shurtcut myself.
You will soon get the logfile to share with Eric.

I will be surprised if you Eric got any other results your self if testing. :slight_smile:

EDIT:
Latest update. Qnap have discovered a bad memory in my TS-453-PRO.
Time for shopping.

Hi Eric & @crieke

So now after installing a fresh 16 GB of new RAM, I did once again run the test. Same file as before. And same result. So I probably need to test with another fresh backup as well, but I’m quite sure the result will be the same. As also old backups get this result. as well as my sonicTransport.

Logfile just a few min away.

The empty audio settings page is probably due to the failed system update. Can you run the QTS update again? Most probably there are library files not in place that should be there by system default…

Not firmware update ? QTS update is done how ?

Remember this issue will also happen if I try restore to a SonicTransporter, as @NOA experiences as well.

EDIT:
I think you mean reinstall latest firmware :slight_smile:

Only done by SSH so far and lost all data twice. I try the other method then,
Hope I’m able to get the right firmware file…

I have also startet a fresh backup from my SonicTransporter i5
ScreenShot265

I forget to tell you, but I did a firmware update today after new memory modules was installed as there was a new release available. Don’t you think is a bit wasted to reinstall that firmware ?

@Eric & Christopher

So I just did another restore with this evening backup from the SonicTransporter to the Qnap. As expected same result.

Hi @Eric,

additionally I think my problems started in time with ST update 2.5.
Therefore a look at this topic is worth while as well and flag @agillis as well:

Hoping for help soon.

Cheers
NOA

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Mine look the same:

ScreenShot266

Actually when copy over from my R2008R2 file server to NAS the “dot” one is not comming over…
(Or I have to turn on hidden files, not sure)

A lot of files BTW:

EDIT:
Confirming backups are equal on 2008R2 and Qnap

@R1200CL and @NOA ----- Thank you both for the follow ups and providing the requested logs. I have seen both of your PMs and am preparing my report (containing your logs) as we speak for our tech team to asses the issue being experienced here.

Once my report has been updated with the team’s thoughts/findings I will be sure to touch base with you both immediately. Your patience while the team conducts their analysis is very appreciated!

-Eric

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Sure, thanks @Eric.

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@R1200CL ----- After discussing your report with our techs and looking at the logs the team has asked for the following.

In order for us to be able to properly help troubleshoot the issue you are reporting with your backups, we will really need to focus on a single setup. It seems that you have a couple iterations of your Roon configuration that are being used during troubleshooting and we can absolutely help with troubleshooting these as well, but in the interest of expediting this process we really need to focus on one Roon setup. This will allow us to diagnose the problem more concisely and provide the advice that you need in a timely manor.

With the above in mind, may I very kindly ask you for the following:

  • Please provide insight into why you are restoring from a backup. Have you run into issues? Just a general practice during your Roon use? Are you testing? Our techs would like to have a better idea as to what is prompting this action.

  • Please describe (in detail) the Roon configuration that you would like help with in regard to this issue. We need to know what is acting as your core machine, where the backups are being stored/pulled from, where your musical collection is being housed, and how all these elements are communicating with Roon/your network.

  • Once the above configuration is “in place” please reproduce the issue you are encountering, note the time when it occurs, and then send us another setup of Roon logs using the same method as before.

Lastly, you mentioned the following in one of your posts:

“I think the restore should not take more than 5 til max 15 min.”

I think it’s important to remember that the a backup contains numerous small files and the “speed” of the restore process (as I am sure you are aware) is all contingent on the size of your database. If my database is small I would expect a speedy restore from a backup but if my database is HUGE the process may take some time.

-Eric

It all started with that my SonicTransporter i5 died. And I needed a new SSD. I had backups, but non of them was/are working.

Well, actually the core machine is just now the repaired SonicTransporter, but since I’m 100% convinced backup is not working, as I have testet this against my Qnap as well as the SonicTransporter, I do not like to test backup and restore on the SonicTransporter before I know it’s working on the Qnap.

Actually I claim that backup and restore is not working in Roon on a general basis, but I expect you totally disagree :slight_smile:

If you like, I can of cause test on a Windows PC.
So I think we have to start with the Qnap machine.

To eliminate any network problems the files both music and backups is stored in the Qnap TS-453-Pro with 16 GB of new RAM, and latest firmware on a stripe with various SSD’s configured as a singel volume. I do have a copy of the files somewhere else, that I consider as my master storage. It’s in a 2008R2, but since this one have issues and will cause dropouts I suggest we just forget it. There is no sync job set up present. Well the 2008R2 sync to JottaCloud :grinning:

The SonicTransporter is now also pointing towards the Qnap storage where it’s getting the music library. (Before from the 2008R2).
It aslo have one backup from the SonicTransporter configured to point towards the Qnap as well as another one towards the 2008R2

My incoming net goes thru a iPCop firewall and DHCP server with SNORT.
The main switch in my computer room is a Cisco SG300-20 20-Port with firmware 1.4.5.02.
This is where both Qnap and SonicTransporter is connected. Before it was via another switch in my living room.

Well I will once again delete the Roon database under the “RoonServer” directory in Qnap. Reinstall Qnap and reinstall the latest backup available.
I will be very surprised if the issues is not the same as before.
The logfile will be as small as the one you already have.

As the whole process of restoring my just less than 30 000 tracks just above 1TB and since it’s not requiring network, is less than 5 minute, I could even even post a video of the seance, but this site do not allowed to upload videos.

Anyway, stating the time is hard, as nothing is happening. The restore isn’t working. according to my previous descriptions in this thread. I can tell you exactly how many seconds it will take from starting counting to 100% but I really don’t think that’s what you’re asking.

Anyway I will start now.

EDIT:
The restore of database took exactly 3 min.

Unfortunately now the Roon want even start :persevere:

It’s getting worse…

So I suppose I have to try another backup.
Or do you like to have this file instead ?

EDIT no 2
Not even the backup that was “working” isn’t working.
Is it only the RoonServer logs, or also tjhe RAAT server logs you like to have ?

Anyway, did just send you some logfiles.

Hi @R1200CL ---- Thank you for the follow up. I have received your logs and will pass the over to the team for evaluation.

I am curious about something, you made this statement in your follow up:

"Actually I claim that backup and restore is not working in Roon on a general basis, but I expect you totally disagree "

By no means do I intend to argue this point with you, however I am curious as to what brings you to this conclusion merely from a “feedback” standpoint. Have you never been able to restore from a backup in your setup? Have you tested saving/restoring backups from dropbox?

Furthermore, how large of a library is being stored on the TS-453-Pro based on track count? Also, you mentioned that you are currently implementing a managed switch in your PM. Have you tested with flow control enabled on this device?

Lastly, I’d also be curious how things respond in your setup with a more “condensed” version of your configuration. During your troubleshooting of this issue you are having with your Roon backups have you tried getting your core machine, NAS, and a remote device all on a single unmanaged switch OR perhaps directly connected to your router to see how things perform?

-Eric

@R1200CL @NOA – Eric and I just discussed this and I was wondering if you guys could upload your backups somewhere for us to look at quickly? I think that may expedite things and help us understand exactly what’s going on here.

We are currently looking into a few bugs with our backup functionality that can cause some relatively minor issues. It can cause issues locating backups on your hard drive, and also affects things like deleting old backups. We are taking these issue seriously, but none of the issues we’re currently aware of can cause data loss, or backup corruption.

We’ve also heard a lot of feedback about a change last year that made files and folders inside the RoonBackups folder hidden. We are going to be changing that behavior as well but none of these issues should cause the symptoms you’re describing, so I’d like to first understand whether this is an issue with your environment, the archives themselves, or perhaps a different bug.

It’s possible there is something else going on here, but looking at your backup archive will clarify things. We’re about to do a full round of regression testing on backups once the current changes are complete, so if there is something else going on here, now is the time for us to understand the problem and resolve it.

Again, to be clear:

While files and folders inside the /RoonBackups folder are hidden, we are not currently aware of any issues that can cause loss of data or backup corruption.

What would be great for both of you to do is the following:

  • Zip up the entire /RoonBackups folder you are trying to restore
  • Upload that zip file somewhere we can download it from:
    • if you have Dropbox or similar, that’s great – PM me a link
    • If you don’t have Dropbox, let us know how big the zip file is and and we can give you a way to upload it to us

We take backups seriously, and we appreciate everyone’s patience as we work out these issues in a safe and deliberate manner.

I have JottaCloud :slight_smile:
You will get online access !
(Well a shareable link it is). 13GB oh…it will take time. Or actually not, this will be an excellent opportunity for you guys to test JottaCloud speed :slight_smile:
(Yes, I have suggested Jottacloud as a service you ought to support)

This evening I tried to force backup from my SonicTransporter to the 2008R2 server and it’s failing.
From a windows machine I can browse the folders.
And even at present time my SonicTransporter is not playing files from the 20008R8, but the Qnap, the SonicTransporter via Roon do find the folders etc.
Which it wouldn’t if the 2008 was unaccessable. Strange.

I haven’t made the last backup that seems to be OK (Meaning Roon stats its successful) on Jottacloud yet. Let me know if that one is wanted as well.

I just did one:
ScreenShot276

And at present time of writing I have not tried to restore that present working backup to my Qnap.

No, as not needed before now :slight_smile:
Well actually I may be lying. I most likely did about a year ago when I switched from my Qnap to my SonicTransporter.
A mans mind is very short :slight_smile:

Anyway your support is highly appreciated. And I hope I’m one of very few that has this issue, if any, and that I haven’t discovered a minor bug in the release :slight_smile:

No, to expensive. Dropbox has excellent functionality. Work on all platform. Maybe the best cloud storrage there is for personal use and share minor files.
Huge library’s > JottaCloud is preferable. You guys should contact them :slight_smile:

Does this pic answer your question. I hope that’s what you’re asking ?
(As you have copy of my file manager count of file and size on a previous post)

Nope, I must I admit at present time I don’t have knowledge on the subject.
I will open the web user interface and see if I’m getting any wiser.

Not latley.
I can of cause move the two boxes into my living room if you think it matters, or even better just add a small switch in my computer room instead of using the switch in living room.
Still those switches will be behind or after the managed switch.

Or are you suggestion I put a switch between my iPCop and the managed switch and just attach SonicTransporter and the Qnap to that little unmanned switch ?
If so, may I ask what is the theory behind such an approach ?

@Eric
What does it mean “computing”, as I expect it should say preparing if I remember correctly ?

ScreenShot278

Why does cancelling take long time ?

ScreenShot279

This Flow control settings isn’t straight forward. As I think I must enable or crate LAG and when I do that network is gone for those ports.

In order to enable Flow Control I think I must enable LAG (link aggregation control) as well. And then the question is:
Should I apply LACP, which lead to does Roon support LACP ? (Static or dynamic whatever the difference is).

I guess I will have to verify with Qnap if they do and @agillis if the SonicTransporter does, but that may be part of the Roon answer or maybe not ?

Please advice