Hopefully this will make sense - so was looking the place where Ron configured DSP Gain Boost ( the famous 6db ) and maybe also the low pass filter, although I normally don’t mess with that.
Searching the knowledge base yields some old docs:
The DSD-PCM conversion settings are in settings/audio in that version.
In Roon 1.8 I could not find them until decided to look under the DSP options for the interface - however it is a bit confusing now. The old software as per the doc, had those settings outside of DSP - which makes sense to me - this is something that is imho, kind of a must do, even if technically DSP. Guess is fine, depends on how you look at it. The problem is that it looks to me like you have to enable DSP upsampling in order to get the Gain Boost ( and the low pass filter it looks like ) for DSD. However, there is a setting for upsampling that indicates to only stop at compatibility, not maximum rate… which is the default behaviour of Roon… And the DSD to PCM options have a note indicating that they may take effect even if only in compatibility mode. Which again, is the default.
So in short and to make it succint:
Do you have to enable the upsampling dsp option to get the DSD Gain Boost (and the low pass filter)?
DSD to PCM Gain and DSD to PCM Filter are just as their setting names indicates – for use in DSD to PCM conversion. They do not apply to DSD upsampling.
Thanks for the reply but just to clarify so I get the info I am looking for - I AM NOT talking about DSD upsampling - this is all on the “Sample Rate Conversion” DSP option - Scroll down and you will see the DSD TO PCM options which is what I am asking about - specifically
Do you have to have the “Sample Rate Conversion” enabled in order to get the DSD TO PCM Gain Books And the DSD TO PCM Low Pass filter?
Thanks for your reply, though… appreciate the time
Again, the two DSD to PCM settings in question are invoked only when DSD is converted to PCM. That, of course, is a form of Sample Rate Conversion, which can occur due to user settings or compatibility reasons.
In the end, just view the Signal Path. Is DSD being converted to PCM? If not, then the aforementioned two settings do not apply.
Indeed and I am only asking about DSD TO PCM. NOT AT ALL ABOUT DSD UPSAMPLING - I understand most peeps mind will go there as I see it is very common. Not talking about that at all.
DSD TO PCM conversion ends up 6db too quiet so most DSD TO PCM conversions will have a 6db gain boost. HOWEVER - Roon 1.8 puts those options under the Sample Rate Conversion filter ( man I wish I was on my Mac - there is no Linux Remote so I cannot screenshot it ) but I want to clarify, IF IT WILL BE DONE BY DEFAULT when converting DSD TO PCM OR YOU HAVE TO ENABLE THE FILTER. BECAUSE IS A INSIDE THE OPTIONS FOR THE FILTER, it is not clear if the boost will be applied ONLY WHEN ENABLING THE Sample Rate Conversion FILTER or if it will be done regardless - Roon help is not quite clear on this - JRIVER for example does it regardless of any other DSP, as again, DSP TO PCM conversion ends up 6db too quiet.
Like I said, I appreciate you taking the time - but I am only talking about DSD TO PCM conversion. WHEN DOING DSD TO PCM - NOT SURE IF IT WILL BE DONE INDEPENDENTLY OF THE UPSAMPLING FILTER BEING ENABLED.
So as you can see it seems like the DSD TO PCM Gain will only take effect IF Sample Rate Conversion IS ENABLED - however there is verbiage on the GUI help that seems imply it will happen anyway. So not sure which one is it - Do I have to enable Sample Rate Conversion to get the Gain (boost)? or will it happen by default, again, because is very necessary? Roon support?
Automatically applying +6 dB gain in all DSD to PCM conversion is a bad idea. It will result in 0 dBFS digital clipping on some DSD that exceeds the Scarlet Book 50 percent modulation depth standard.
That makes sense - that said - the reason I ask is because indeed all of my DSD seem too quiet under Roon… So most of the time it will be necessary, I think, imho - same back when I used JRiver - getting rid of the boost - too quiet… that’s why I wanted to confirm - if the gain boost is done no matter what, then I may have issues… anxious to be able to test - but wanted to have the info…
Our apologies, it looks like this post fell through the cracks
You do not need to have the Sample Rate Conversion DSP stage enabled for the DSD to PCM settings on that screen to be in effect. They will be applied whenever DSD to PCM conversion is active, even when Roon automatically performs the conversion.
I know in general that DSD must typically be converted to PCM to do any EQ. Must this apply also to a wholesale signal boost when working entirely in pure DSD? I have the Holo Bliss KTE amp for my Susvara and other cans, and the performance is extraordinary. However, even as a bespoke, high-powered amp, many DSD recordings require that the volume be turned up near-max. There is no gain option on the amp, only impedance for headphone matching. It’s a great pot, neat gradations and lots of subtle control. But is it possible in principal to boost a DSD signal WITHOUT conversion?
No. Any DSD-to-DSD processing requires, at a minimum, a bit depth extension and a low-pass filter before processing and a bit depth reduction through a delta-sigma modulation after processing. If you send DSD directly to the DAC, the DAC should, in theory, output a 50%-modulated DSD signal and a 0dBFS PCM signal at comparable levels.
Contrary to what a certain person here says, yes, DSD can have the gain increased with out conversion to PCM. But I don’t think Roon does that. HQPlayer does…maybe @jussi_laako can respond here with a more complete answer.
