DSD maximum sample rate reported lower for Ayon S-10II

@support
Windows 10 / Roon 1.7
Ayon S-10 II via ethernet connection

Hi,
In the setup of my network player / DAC I noticed that the DSD Max sample rate is 128, while S-10 II clearly supports DSD256. Subsequently in playing back a DSD256 file I get this path


The same “issue” is with the max PCM supported rate, which per setup in Roon is 384, while Ayon’s specs are up to 768
Additionally, in the setup screen there is no option for Native support for DSD!
Can you help please!
TEXT GOES HERE

sometimes not all rates are supported on all inputs. The first thing I would do is verify that you can get dsd 256 over ethernet in the manual/tech specs/or by emailing ayon tech support.

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Thank you for your attention to my issue! I did verify it, since other software (JRiver where I am coming from… I am in testing environment), plays DSD256 via Ayon S-10 II perfectly.
Contrary, Roon as you saw in the original post downsamples!

With the JRiver, were you using USB Input, or Network input via JRiver UPnP / DLNA ? If you were using USB input, it is not comparable as Rugby said.

Have you tried using native app to play DSD256 over network?

I am using exactly the same setup (connections, hardware etc.) with both systems i.e. JRiver and Roon. To clarify (my mistake I did not already described it…) my system is as follows:

  • Music files reside on Synology NAS (fully dedicated to music)
  • Fully dedicated Windows 10 laptop carries Roon Core (and JRiver)
  • Ayon S-10 II Network player/DAC is connected to the above via network (ethernet) to the above.
  • JRiver is using UPnP / DLNA to communicate with Ayon. Roon obviously is using RAAT
    Yes I can play DSD256 directly via Ayon’s app… so I can via JRiver.
    Ayon S-10 II supports per manual DSD256 and PCM up to 768 sample rates!

If the native app supports a higher sample rate than the RAAT implementation, then you need to check the Roon Device Setup - Advanced, and make sure you have the correct values of Max Sample (PCM) and Max Sample Rate (DSD) - although these should have been set automatically in the first place.

If the correct values are not available, you need to ask your device manufacturer to modify the RAAT implementation accordingly, or there is something special you need to configure in your unit (less likely).

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Thank you! I have already send Ayon an email. I may need to come back!

Hello @Sot_13, please keep us posted on what they say.

Hi @nuwriy. I got an answer back, not quite satisfactory I must say. The answer I received verbally via Ayon’s distributor in my country.

Apparently what I “discovered” (i.e. not allowing in the device advanced setup screen to choose DSD256 (and PCM768 for that matter) although natively supported), is a conscientious decision due to SQ issues (…via Roon???).
The strange thing is that there is no problem in playing DSD256 files, via JRiver (I have) or Audirvana (I also test…).

I don’t understand! Also what I don’t understand is that the said equipment is “Roon ready” and Roon Tested". And quoting from your site “Roon Ready network devices have Roon’s streaming technology built in, and are certified by Roon Labs to provide the highest level of quality and performance in network streaming.” When Roon provided that “stamp of approval” didn’t Roon check this?

(Please note that I do understand that this issue affects a very limited number of tracks in my current library…nevertheless…)

Hello @Sot_13, and thanks for keeping us updated! I’m going to run this thread by our device team and I’ll return with their feedback.

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Hello @Sot_13,

In the setup of my network player / DAC I noticed that the DSD Max sample rate is 128, while S-10 II clearly supports DSD256. Subsequently in playing back a DSD256 file I get this path
The same “issue” is with the max PCM supported rate, which per setup in Roon is 384, while Ayon’s specs are up to 768

Apparently what I “discovered” (i.e. not allowing in the device advanced setup screen to choose DSD256 (and PCM768 for that matter) although natively supported), is a conscientious decision due to SQ issues (…via Roon???).

The Ayon S-10 II supports different maximum sample rates on its USB input verses the network input.

I can confirm that the maximum PCM rate for the network input is 384 kHz for all sources.

For DSD, there are two possibilities:

A) The device supports DSD256 via its network input but it’s erroneously reporting a lower sample rate to Roon.

B) The device supports DSD128 max, and when playing other sources there is a conversion from DSD256 -> DSD128 at some point in the signal chain.

We will reach out to Ayon to find out what’s happening.

-John

Hello @john
Thank you. Here is an extract of the S-10 II specifications from the user’s manual. Right at the top are the conversion rates.


Regarding DSD256 I repeat that they are played without any problem via other software (JRiver and Audirvana). I have not tried PCM768 because I do not have such a file.
My S-10 II is connected via ethernet.
Regards

Can’t you set JRiver to upsampled to that rate?

I never used DSP - I will try and come back…

Ok. Test done. Through DSP in JRiver I send an upsampled file to S-10 II. Contrary to specification, it appears that it can handle in PCM up to 24bit/368Khz. In trying higher rates ie. 705 / 768 the player reported error!
Note that in DSD it is true to spec ie. it handles DSD256, no problem!

Hi @john . Any news on this issue?

Hello @Sot_13,

Thanks for your patience, I have what is hopefully good news to share.

Ayon has investigated and confirmed the issue. They plan to fix it in an upcoming firmware update, tentatively scheduled for Q2 this year.

For status updates, Ayon will be your best resource.

I’m going to mark this thread as solved for now. Feel free to open a new support thread if anything else pops up.

-John

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