Dutch & Dutch 8c: pre-Roon Ready thread

You seem to have been very pleased with them but mention you miss them. Did you sell and buy something else?

That´s right ! I love to try out new gear . Had them for 1,5 years and felt that i wanted to try something new . I only have space for one set up at the time , otherwise i would have saved them.

Out of curiosity what speaker are you listening to currently?

The Genelec 8361A, also active with DSP.

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Impressive, any thoughts on relative strengths/weaknesses between the 8C and the Genelecs?

I asked @J.D this question in another thread and he was kind enough to reply:

Both speakers deliver the best sound for money ive ever heard. They actually (to my ears) sound very alike. Transparent with a tweeter that never becoms to harsh .

Genelec 8361A has a slighly better soundstage due to the coaxial design. The midrange on the 8361A is also just a bit better , more open , clearer.

Both speakers are really good, but you need to integrate them to the room via DSP . They become twice as good then. It´s day and night in difference .

That is an interesting observation, as one of the USPs of the D&Ds is making the room ‘disappear’ at those frequencies to improve clarity via reduced room interaction.

Dont get me wrong , had the DD for 1,5 years . They are AMAZING speakers . But this was the first thing that i noticed . The midrange of the Genelec plays with a bit nore ease. Its actually the first time I get the feeling that its very close to Beryllium properties. The sounds just "come off / come loose " in a very nice way. And the Coaxial driver is hands down one of the best ive heard . A lot of RnD has been put in to make that.

On friday i am gonna make some convolution filters in ROON and see if i can get them even better . I dont have the proper GLM know how to date.

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How does the bass compare?

I have followed this thread for a while. J.D. has contributed a lot when he’s having 8c. I knew he changed to Genelec 8361. At the end, I just bought 8c and wait for delivery. But I actually want to try both if possible. I see Genelec should have some advantages over 8c for its axial and the single source concept (assuming they both perform well in SQ). 8c’s inherent advantage however is something Genelec doesn’t have - designed to be put close to the wall (for Genelec, you could still put close to the wall but have to do something more to adjust) and its down to 100Hz directivity. I tried many speakers, 8c impresses me most with its extremely even directivity. I have a feeling that if you are not preparing to furnish the room with more panels or acoustics control, and you like to walk around the room and still enjoy high quality ‘room sound’, 8c probably is the one to deliver this the best among others. Both have its advantages over another at some particular areas, which may need to be thought about what one needs most. Having said all this, I may buy 8361a to play after experimenting enough for 8c … that should be fun! I actually like the 8351b and W391 combination. But I don’t know how to place them to fit my room decor haha. Reselling them is actually very difficult …

Thanks for the background information.

Had some 8c’s on a week’s trial. Good speakers, and excellent at the their price point.

Technology is impressive, and the measurements are excellent. But they sounded a little over-processed to me, whether with or without room-correction filters applied, and to my ears the vocals and higher frequencies were too forwards for extended listening. Clear, decent (though not outstanding) bass, tightly controlled. Analytical more than emotional. I’d seriously consider them for a difficult room/awkward positioning, but in a dedicated room which is relatively neutral, I’ve decided I have heard better things and so they went back. Well worth a listen if you’re interested in active speakers though.

Oh, and the lack of Roon readiness was a bit of a killer for me, as it meant an additional box and an additional D/A then A/D conversion step (though with other cabling I could have mitigated that). But with 2 emails on this question unanswered by the company, I don’t see it happening any time soon… and it didn’t help their sales case…

But thanks to Keith for the loan, and well recommended that you listen for yourself.

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Thanks! Very refreshing to get a different view on the 8c. A bit surprising that you found them forward sounding, but I haven’t heard the 8c yet so I do not know if I would hear the same myself. After reading quite a lot about the 8c I have the impression that they are actually rather dark sounding. They can still sound forward of course. I suppose the room would be a factor here.
Pity RAAT is still not available and D&D can be somewhat hit and miss responding to email unfortunately.

I don’t know. I’ve had the 8c for 5 months or so. They sound good to me. They replaced Klipsch la scala and Bottlehead amps. I tried A/B comparison with the La Scalas and they seemed about the same. But, when I listen to the D&D loud I convince myself they sound better. I think they do.

BTW, I have not done any room correction.

Very disappointed that no support to Roon so far, and without firmware update.

“seemed about the same” is quite a statement given they’re two completely different speakers.

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Yeah, I was surprised that they didn’t sound more different. I think it speaks to the quality of the 8C’s. My comparison wasn’t scientific, with the two sets of speakers at opposite ends of a room and a few seconds delay in the switch. Also, it wasn’t blind so there was bias involved.

When I compared the Klipsch and 8C I don’t think I played any material with a lot of bass. The 8C play bass very well, probably much better than the Klipsch. I did have the 8C on loan for over a month and decided to purchase them and retire the La Scalas. The 8c are well balanced and I don’t need to adjust the frequency balance. I agree that Roon would be nice but my player (Bricasti M5) sounds fine for my Tidal source.

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Does anyone have trouble with achieving enough volume using a minidsp shd studio? Even with it at 0.0 on the minidsp the 8cs wouldn’t get anywhere close to as loud as me feeding them an analog signal from my matrix audio headphone amp. Yes I did switch the input to AES when using the minidsp. Seems like a company that sells speakers that retail for almost $15k a pair would be a little more transparent with where they actually are with releasing the roon ready firmware. Or at least give us the option of the beta version that new customers are getting. I have been waiting a long time for it and some of you have been waiting much longer.