Endless adding to library

Hi @Michael_Putz, can you try this:

  • Take the RoonBackups folder and move it to a new location (maybe a USB drive)
  • Try restoring a backup from this new location

Let us know if there is any change when doing so!

Hi @dylan,
It’s just the same. I’ve copied the Backup folder on the USB drive. In settings → backup I’Ve chosen the backup folder on the USB, and the options are the same:

Hello @Michael_Putz ,

Can you please confirm that you moved only the RoonBackups folder to the USB drive and not the entire Backups folder? The QA team has noted that this issue may be occurring due to the nested Backup/RoonBackups folder, please confirm this when possible, thanks!

@noris - I’ve moved the complete Backup folder to the USB.

@noris, @dylan

The main issue for me - now - is the completely annoying slow performance that I have descibed.
With tears in my eyes I’ve kind of accepted that the tagging I’ve done over almost six months obviously is blown in the wind… What a waste…

Now, crucial for my decision if I stay with Roon or quit will be a reliably smooth performance with 40k+ tags…

Hello @Michael_Putz ,

For the restore to be detected, the folder structure needs to be changed with the RoonBackups folder being the root folder, we believe the backup issue occurs due to the way it is currently structured.

We have done some further testing in the QA lab and we have been able to reproduce an issue when using a large number of tags (5-10k and over).

Using tags in such a high volume is a rare use case and further optimization would be needed and I am unable to comment on when/if such further optimization would occur.

Instead, would it be possible for you to try to add your tracks to playlists (or genre-based playlists) and see if that allows improvement? Thank you!

Found the Aug 2021 backup! Thanks! Started the restoring process FIVE HOURS AGO - STILL RUNNING… Is this normal?

Hi @noris - I’ve managed to restore the most recent backup (Aug 2021) which is absolutely fantastic! Thank you very much for you help!! As the screen did not came back to life after I’ve connected the uptade to the Nucleus, I’ve had to interrupt this process (after about six hours of running without any visible effect).
However, it seems to work now!

I’ll watch the further performance of Roon very closely for the next couple of weeks.


Oh, wow - so Roon is kind of officially telling me that, say, 10k+ tags for tracks is not what Roon was designed for? That’s quite a bold statement and makes me wonder, if marketing slogans and actual reality do match…
I’ll consider if the playlist workaround you’ve mentioned will be of any help for me…

However, I’d like to understand: Does your statement refer to ANY 10k+ tags for tracks, or did the problem occur, if ONE AND THE SAME TAG for 10k+ tracks was tagged?

Thanks !

So would I. Users have got into performance issues in the past from excessive tagging, so what constitutes excessive is critical to know.
Just had a look at my library and I have:

  • 17 unique tags defined
  • 584 albums with those tags (many albums have multiple tags, I don’t tag individual tracks)
  • Over 7000 tracks contained in those tagged albums (assuming avg 12 tracks per album)

Am I sailing close to the wind or nowhere near?

@noris — an answer would be very much appreciated, thank you!

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Hey @Michael_Putz,

Sorry we didn’t get a chance to get back to you until today, when we returned to work after the weekend.

I believe what Noris was trying to say is that having 5,000-10,000 tracks tagged with the same tag, might cause issues. Having 10,000 tracks in your library with a tag attached shouldn’t be an issue.

That’s actually pretty scary!
I assumed he meant 10k plus different tags.
Not just 10k tracks tagged with say " symphonic prog rock".
Now do we mean individual tracks tagged or when an album of say 12 tracks is tagged it then makes the 12 tracks inclusive of said tag?
Or is just one entry if you only tag the album and not each individual track within?
It seems to be easily achieved by users with large libraries who spend time curating whichever it is though.

Well the easy way around this is to split your 20,000 symphonic prog rock tracks into Symphonic prog 1 and symphonic prog 2 tags etc.

However, the figure stated by Noris was ‘5-10k and over’, so you may need four symphonic prog rock tags to be ‘safe’?

Maybe but I don’t think that is something I or anyone else should have to do or try to remember to do.

It would be nice to get some real situations on the table here. I suspect that it’s not quite as simple as saying that "5,000-10,000 tracks tagged with the same tag , might cause issues. What are the situations where “might” becomes “will”?

I don’t have many Tags in use, but one of them is applied to over 30,000 objects (tracks, in this case). Roon takes this in its stride, and doesn’t miss a beat.

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Agreed but the OP does seem to have a use case that Roon wasn’t designed or tested for. As we know, Roon doesn’t test for ‘large’ libraries.

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Agree that it would be good to get a better clarification on this one!

Hey @AceRimmer and @Geoff_Coupe,

Thanks for keeping an eye on this thread and for showing your interest in this particular topic.

I’ve circled back with our technical and QA teams to learn more about this behavior and share more.

Please, stay tuned :nerd_face:

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After many decades with more than a dozen software products and music services that have come and gone, I no longer rely on vendor solutions.

Tagging follows an industry standard

This page is also referenced here

and quickly you are at MP3TAG or Foobar2000

There you learn to stick to these standards as well as to tag very freely and flexibly. The advantage, it is also really in the file, which fits to the own order love and can be read out by further programs.

Even if these or another programs are deleted, so no library exists there any more, everything is preserved and evaluable for the case of need and e.g. transferable into spreadsheets like Excel or LibreOffice.

Only in this way is mass tagging really possible and one does not drag oneself from field to field.