I wanted to use the USB input/output! This is very silly indeed! Not many DAC’s will have the hdmi input even as “I2S”! What is the workaround please? Ironically I just sold my DDC because i thought i wouldn’t need it anymore with ROON! You have to laugh as this gets more absurd by the minute! LOL!
Why does ROCK limit the output to HDMI only in the first place?
many thanks for your time and effort!
I don’t work for Roon, but like many companies nowadays they don’t provide hands-on support for end users outside of software (bugs) or hardware issues (faults).
This is fairly normal practice, my router manufacturer won’t help me setup my home network, Microsoft won’t help me with my Excel spreadsheets and Spotify couldn’t care less about my HiFi setup.
What Roon do provide is various guides, help pages and a community forum. It can be frustrating as a new user, especially when what seems like a simple question generates half a dozen conflicting answers, but people are genuinely just trying to be helpful.
As I said above, in your situation I’d install RoonOS on the NUC and use it as both endpoint & server. Once you have it installed then you can go into the audio settings and it should be obvious where you can select different output devices.
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My fault, I forgot to mention you can also use USB on the NUC. So you’d connect your DAC to one of the USB sockets and select it under settings > audio in the Roon interface.
(sorry, that was a total mind blank on my part…haha! When I was tying my reply I was thinking of the non-USB audio outputs, like S/PDIF and so blanked on USB which is obviously the near default option for hooking up a DAC. Anyway, yes USB → DAC works fine on NUC)
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yes, this is what i guessed the companies practice already is, but thank you for confirming their “nothing to do with us attitude”!
No, i don’t want to use the NUC as the server, just an endpoint.
thank you!
“My fault, I forgot to mention you can also use USB on the NUC”
LOL! WOW! deep breath! Very Scary moment! You had me going there for a while, heart beat went through the roof! Glad you cleared that up! No problem, we all do silly things sometimes, I should know! No need to apologise for this one mate and thanks for the “heads-up”!
I guess their answer would be to buy a Roon Nucleus and that ROCK / Roon OS is a DIY solution offered for free, but without any hands on support.
Anyway…that’s all kind of irrelevant to this conversation…
Is there a good reason you don’t want the NUC to be both the server & endpoint? Doing that would almost certainly be the easiest solution to get you up and running with a truly headless setup.
Why make life more complex…
Personally I’d try that first, it might be that once you have that working you no longer feel there’s a need to install a sever elsewhere. You’ll also have a better understanding of how Roon / Roon OS works by doing that.
Otherwise your only option is to install the regular Roon Server package on your PC under whichever OS you prefer (Windows or Linux) and get that OS to boot up headless. But getting that OS to boot up headless is outside the scope of Roon, as it’s a OS thing.
As mentioned above, Roon OS is only designed to to run on selected NUC models, it might install on other machines but isn’t official supported and even community support will be hard to come by due to all the unknown factors involved. But you don’t need to use Roon OS to run Roon Server, it’'s just a nicely packaged, low-maintenance, self-updating way of doing so, as it doesn’t require a separate host operating system like Windows. It also happen to the the same OS that Roon’s Nucleus uses.
[1] If your dead set on separating them out, then I’d probably make the NUC the server with Roon OS installed (and put it in another room) and then get a small, low-cost endpoint (without any moving parts or a fan) like a RPi with Ropiee installed and connect that to my DAC. Although the only real benefit to doing this is that you no longer have to have a NUC on display in your HiFI rack with potential fan noise although the fan on the NUC rarely kicks in during normal use.
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At last, a warm & friendly person that appears to understand where i am coming from? On my wavelength possibly? Or just diplomatic? I am AUTISTIC, and cannot learn in the conventional manner, as I found out 45 years ago at school! I have an unusual way (round about way) of learning and absorbing information, which often leads to misunderstandings and discrimination! Glad I encountered you on here - thanks! Take care!
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“I guess their answer would be to…”
this is truly fantastic! The way you communicate is right up my street; you know how to talk and address people properly on a down to earth level! I thank you for that! I am autistic but i may have said that already? Sorry!
I will answer this post later on as i am tired and need bed for a few hours due to a thyroid problem (i.e. energy both physical and mental). Take care and thank you for your understand help! You should be on the support team!
Careful! ~ don’t get too helpful and personal, the mods. may not like it? LOL!
You should have bought a Roon Nucleus for server and Raspberry Pi4 for endpoint. Both are headless “out of the box.”
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yes i know roon would love me to buy a roon nucleus, but i can’t afford that. What i have bought used is far cheaper and within my budget and apparently it can be used headless with rock. (or audiolinux OS).
I guess their answer would be to buy a Roon Nucleus and that ROCK / Roon OS is a DIY solution offered for free, but without any hands on support.Anyway…that’s all kind of irrelevant to this conversation…
Yes they’d love that, wouldn’t they? If only I had that sort of money to waste! LOL!
Is there a good reason you don’t want the NUC to be both the server & endpoint? Doing that would almost certainly be the easiest solution to get you up and running with a truly headless setup.
Yes I have read loads of stuff on the internet, forums & youtube and there definitely seems to be a consensus of acceptance from those debunking branded servers in favour of making your own, not least of which is cost! Also, by doing so the work load is shared between two machines, big pc for server and smaller pc for the final output before DAC. Seems to suggest that it is ‘better’ to have a small smallish pc for the endpoint less noise and I guess that is why people buy insanely expensive micro rendu & optical rendu etc.? (which are endpoints). Although Piero of Audiolinux suggests that even the end PC should be quite beefy? Don’t really get that approach? I can understand having a powerful PC for the sever and music library storage so that it will process an entire catalogue quickly and efficiently, and remove the need for NAS etc? Piero hates NAS methods! Also this guy has a lot to say on the pc/server/endpoint subject: https://www.youtube.com/@OCDHIFiGuy - I also learn a lot from: https://www.audiosciencereview.com/
https://audiophilestyle.com, https://www.head-fi.org, https://forum.audiogon.com, https://www.audioasylum.com, https://forums.audioholics.com
Why make life more complex…
I have had the one PC with mouse, keyboard & monitor, with USB storage drive (pen drive), and I wanted to see for myself what all the fuss is about this headless 2/3 PC system (control/server/endpoint) and LISTEN for myself and see if there is any difference? Also I have got rid of ■■■■ loads of expensive cables and ‘filters’ that appears to me to make no discernible difference in listening pleasure and quality! Also AC mains pure sine wave gadgets, afterall, like they say: “the AC mains is converted to (12v) DC anyway! Same with the fibre optical argument & Wi-Fi. There is a lot of snake oil. But you have to try it for yourself and not just take other peoples’ opinions as Gospel Truth!
Personally I’d try combined server/endpoint first, it might be that once you have that working you no longer feel there’s a need to install a sever elsewhere. You’ll also have a better understanding of how Roon / Roon OS works by doing that.
I have already tried one PC solution (see above) and lots of other snake oil, but I had to see for myself to make sure and separate the truth from the snake oil, you see? Not prepared to just take other peoples’ word for it, and let’s face it(!) – most will say: “try it for yourself if you don’t believe me”.
Otherwise your only option is to install the regular Roon Server package on your PC under whichever OS you prefer (Windows or Linux) and get that OS to boot up headless. But getting that OS to boot up headless is outside the scope of Roon, as it’s a OS thing.
Yes, I see! It is outside the Roon scope and that is why I have now at least looked at websites and forums that are concerned with other parts of the equation, e.g. MS Windows which does seem to strongly favour a setup with monitor keyboard and mouse rather than headless? Indeed I haven’t found much about headless Windows? This: “Use the service_secret switch and the path to a valid Service Key to install the Client from the command line. You can get the Service Key from the Service configuration in the Twingate Admin console.” Is this Chinese? It is to me! That is why I presume we have Windows Server instead because it is headless! So use MS server instead of windows to store a music database/library?
Also using dongles to emulate keyboard/mouse & monitor functions to trick windows into booting up! Whereas, Linux, there is loads and loads about headless stuff (usually with command line entries!) which has to be learned! Unless you use Audiolinux and have Piero remotely set it all up by appointment, but you have to pay for membership! Also, Apple/Mac is held in high regard for stability, speed, sound quality etc. Now, recently it has come to my attention about this roon rock minimal OS that will boot automatically to headless, and that you can even install roon server on to that as well? Despite some web sources saying that NOTHING can be added on top of ROON ROCK? Very confusing? I suppose that SUPPORT don’t want to get involved with this? Even though they are both ROON products!
As mentioned above, Roon OS is only designed to to run on selected NUC models, it might install on other machines but isn’t official supported and even community support will be hard to come by due to all the unknown factors involved.
Well I can try it for free and see what happens as my DIY server is very much NUC orientated anyway, and cheaper than an INTEL branded version! (using used parts).
But you don’t need to use Roon OS to run Roon Server, it’'s just a nicely packaged, low-maintenance, self-updating way of doing so, as it doesn’t require a separate host operating system like Windows. It also happen to the the same OS that Roon’s Nucleus uses.
What? – are you saying that roon server does NOT require roon rock or linux or windows o/s to be installed first?
[1] If your dead set on separating them out, then I’d probably make the NUC the server with Roon OS installed (and put it in another room)
HaHa! So now you say that NUC as the Roon server DOES require a separate ROON OS? Very contradictory & confusing?
and then get a small, low-cost endpoint (without any moving parts or a fan) like a RPi with Ropiee installed and connect that to my DAC. Although the only real benefit to doing this is that you no longer have to have a NUC on display in your HiFI rack with potential fan noise although the fan on the NUC rarely kicks in during normal use.
I don’t like RPi/Ropiee! I do like the industrial muscular look on my hifi stand! I don’t mind having bulky boxes there instead of fancy polished fronts with signature font writing and expensive looking feet/adjustable legs etc. I like the rat -rod look very much and wouldn’t mind my whole hifi stand draped in these pc black boxes! I agree with no moving parts and there are non in the NUC, and non in MY DIY server either! I’m not a fan of chic/sleek looking gear! I like bulky boxes and wires everywhere! Those that hide wires are FAKE! Why hide them? Because they look unsightly? Not at all my friend? They are beautiful! LOL! My server case is a Streacom FC9.
ROCK (Roon Optimized Core Kit) is an OS with the sole purpose of running Roon Server. These are two distinct products. Roon Server for Linux is installed on ROCK, and this includes the Roon Bridge component.
Ideally, your server needs to run on an i3 or i7 based PC, and this is dependent in the size of your library, zones used, and DSP employed. Roon server is pretty lightweight; a “beefy” PC is unnecessary.
The optimal setup, recommended by Roon, is a separate server (ROCK, Linux / Windows / macOS running Roon server) plus a network streamer, whether proprietary or an SBC such as the Raspberry Pi running Roon Bridge. This only needs lightweight hardware.
This is explained in the knowledge base linked above.
The best way to start out with Roon is to keep your setup simple. If you decide you like it, the community can guide you toward the best solutions for your circumstances.
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many thanks!
I find it easier to ask a question and HOPEFULLY obtain a correct answer! There is so much ambiguity flying around it’s difficult to tell which advice to follow? one member says one things and another member contradicts it! Or as in jamies’ case, he contradicts himself, very confusing!
So lets see if i can just obtain a simple answer to these questions:
On an endpoint can i just install rock as an OS, OR does it need ‘bridge’ to also be installed after ROCK?
On the server can I just install roon server, OR do i need to install ROCK first/before roon server please?
Endpoint: Rock; or ROCK & BRIDGE?
Server: Roon server; OR ROCK & ROON SERVER?
thanks!
don’t know how many times in various threads I have asked this same simple question to experienced users and just being met with a load of waffle!
installation:
Endpoint: Rock; or ROCK & BRIDGE?
Server: Roon server; OR ROCK & ROON SERVER?
If there is no straight answer forthcoming, then I just have try all possible combinations until i find the right one! When i do, I will put it on the community so that other beginners don’t have to go through all this waffle over and over again!
cheers!
PS: I am NOT asking what ROON is! I am not asking for opinions on what hardware to buy! I am NOT asking about aesthetics! I am not asking about noise or room correction! I am not asking about filters or wires! etc. Please try to stick to the question topic.
“I have read that Rock already contains bridge? Bridge can’t be installed on it;s own without Rock”? “Rock can be installed on it’s own”?
Hello,
even though the history makes it very difficult.
installation:
Endpoint: Rock; or ROCK & BRIDGE?
Server: Roon server; OR ROCK & ROON SERVER?
I mean;
You can install Roon Optimized Core Kit (ROCK) on a computer / NUC without an additional operating system and use it both as an endpoint and as a bridge (headless).
To operate and configure ROON, use the Roon App on Windows / iOS or Android.
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thank you for this!
just to clarify then: ROCK will work as a bridge? without adding bridge separately? Yes?
many thanks
much appreciated!
OK, assuming the above is correct?
That just leaves the server question, (it is irrelevant as to whether I am using supported or un-supported hardware - nothing to do with that element of the equation)…
here goes!
if you have a blank/new pc/device, can ROON SERVER be installed on that device directly, OR would it need an O/S (of some kind) initially/first?
thanx in advance for (on topic) advice, cheers!
These are your options.
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Roon Server is an application that comes in several flavours, each designed for different operating systems. There’s versions for:
- Windows
- MacOS
- Linux
ROCK is a packaging of components of the Roon ecosystem architecture. The package is designed for Intel NUC hardware and will install the Roon Operating System (RoonOS), Roon Server and the Output component (that includes Roon Bridge functionality) on the NUC.
ROCK is not guaranteed to work on other PC hardware.
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