Bill_Janssen
(Wigwam wool socks now on asymmetrical isolation feet!)
41
Yes, if you’re adding a hat like the Allo hat or a HiFiBerry Digi+ Pro. It fulfills two engineering guidelines:
Use the least expensive component that satisfies the requirements, and
Use the most battle-tested tried-and-true component that satisfies the requirements.
Of course, gauging whether something meets the requirements can sometimes be tricky. In general, the only reason I can imagine you would want to prefer the 4 over the three as a streamer is for the improved Ethernet and USB performance; that is, if you want to use it as a standalone Ethernet-to-USB streamer.
Bill_Janssen
(Wigwam wool socks now on asymmetrical isolation feet!)
42
Whether to use a hat-based device at all is another engineering issue. Many older amps, receivers, and preamps don’t have USB inputs (my receiver doesn’t), so to get digital signals in, you have to use the somewhat inferior (only in a very minor way: no rate feedback && source-driven clocking) S/PDIF inputs instead. However, adding a hat to a RPi also means adding to the component count and complexity, and that will inevitably reduce the MTTF (mean time to failure) of the streamer.
I eventually decided to use an outboard DAC with USB input and analog connections to the receiver. Yes, this also decreases the MTTF, but in recompense I get ostensibly more accurate reconstruction of the digital signal into an analog waveform.
For our Great Room, I have used Apple TV (Gen 4) and it works really well. I have the same brand receiver as you are using and a 2415+ Synology NAS serving up around 20K songs along with a Qobuz subscription. The ATV works really well with iPhone/iPad and Roon.
I was responding to the previous poster who seemed to be recommending an Apple TV 4K. I have no idea if you are aware of the limitations of an Apple TV 4K or not.
The new Primare NP5 has just come to market. It isn’t quite as expensive as some of the other players in its space, and it’s design brief is to augment an existing system. It will be fully Roon Ready in the not too distant future. USB plus spdif copper and optical.
Scratching my head with this one. As you note the regular Chromecast has limited bandwidth (as it is intended to support an AV stream which limits audio bandwidth). While Chromecast audio can output a SPDIF signal (vs. Its built-in DAC which ain’t so great that I’ve seen on audio science review) up to 192/24.
Otoh, assuming Cromecast Audios are available anymore. [?] I recall buying extras a while back I never ended up using but did so as I heard they were discontinued. Actually, ya, I dont see it listed on the Google Chromecast page. So I guess one has to locate a seller selling leftovers or buy off the likes of eBay.
Hello Pete !
I once had almost the same setup as you, IMac and Synologi NAS with 45k songs.
I did not like to have my IMac locked up as ROON server, so I bought and Intel NUC (Core I5) with 8 Gb of RAM and 512 Gb M.2 (SSD) and installed ROON server on it.
My endpoint is a RPi 3B with the HiFiBerry Digi Plus Hat, running rooPie OS. My amplifier has a digital input. The HiFiBerry HAT is much cheaper than for example the Allo. You should NOT use a TOSLINK output, whichever HAT you choose. Isolated output (transformer) is preferred. This combination, RPi and HiFiberry is the cheapest you can get. Of course, you can install a DAC HAT and get analog output. Same manufacturers. It is however much more difficult to design a good DAC than a digital device (SPDIF).
Some people say that the Allo sounds better, and it has a very low jitter. I do not know. Also, the power supply is critical, more so for a DAC. The question is if you will be able to hear the finer differences between the devices. The only way for you is to make your own tests. You are lucky if you have the possibility to borrow devices for tests.
Good luck and report back on your findings !
Yes, TOSLINK provides total galvanic isolation !
The issue is the jitter.
You could check out the test performed by AMIRM on AudioScienceReview, he is a real competent
guy and he focuses on the SIGNAL. That is the only way you can compare 2 devices
with each other. It is a difficult test that requires some specific equipment and software.
I will probably test the Allo DigiOne one day, I will buy the basic one though.
I think it is a welldesigned device.
Good listening !
Bill_Janssen
(Wigwam wool socks now on asymmetrical isolation feet!)
54
From what I’ve read, jitter is not really a problem any more, with modern equipment like the Yamaha box Peter has.
On the other hand, one might decide to do away with S/PDIF inputs entirely, and only get gear which has either Roon inside and an Ethernet/WiFi connection, or a USB Type-B input.
I’m likely going to pick up the Primare NP5, which looks like a reasonably priced option which will ALSO let me stream Plex, which would really be great (it has a chromecast built in).
Your Roon Core is your streamer.
You only need a hat on a Raspberry Pi if you want to use an output not on the Pi main board. If you have a USB DAC, you can use the Pi in a hat-less configuration.
My most primitive endpoint is a Raspberry Pi 2 hatless using the internal DAC with the internal audio output connected to a Tivoli 1 radio aux input. The radio is very colored so no need for a fancy hat and DAC. Good for podcast playing and over-night music.
You have the option to start with just the Pi and Roon distribution of choice using the internal DAC or a USB DAC. You can add a hat and S/PDIF interconnect later.
I have used the Schiit Modi3 USB input with a hatless Pi 4 for portable listening with Senheisser HD555 headphones. This pairing sounds quite good but does not do the fine image detail of my Gumby with the DQ-10 speakers.
Jason Stoddard of Schiit is of the opinion that the differences between USB and S/PDIF are minimal with Schiit’s latest Gen 5 USB input receivers. All Schiit DACs do jitter buffering and local clock generation. Jason and Mike talk about this in their Darko.Audio interview videos.
Schiit takes care to filter out noise entry into its converters via the USB input. With other DACs, you may prefer the S/PDIF input for this reason.
TOSlink optical interconnects will kill any ground loops between the digital source and the audio system. This is a good input to use for passing in TV audio when a cable system is used.
John Darko reviews a number of Raspberry Pi hats and endpoints comparing them favorably to the commercial streamers. He has compared the Roon/Allo combo to BlueSound, Sonos, Volumnio, and Mytek Brooklyn Bridge. The Roon/Allo and Roon/HiFiBerry combos compare very well with assembled streaming boxes. It is all a matter of your DIY tolerance and cosmetics tolerance. A Pi with a good hat and case should not be thought of as “cheap”. In fact, they approach the state of the art.
Disclosure: I own a Gumby multibit, a Modi 3 and Magni amp. Also a Cambridge DAC. All use C-Media USB receivers. All have been used with MacOS and Linux but not Win 10.
