Manufacturer (Playback Designs) is being blocked as a Roon certified device

Hi @thd99.999

Thank you for providing the device details. In checking with our Hardware team it looks like the status message you’re seeing is accurate. The Playback Designs MPS-6 is still in the certification pipeline.

Each specific device is tested and certified. Certification isn’t based on the module or internal components that facilitate compatibility. The process includes much more than that.

Once it’s completed you’ll be able to enable it in Roon as a Roon Ready endpoint. We understand your anticipation and appreciate your patience while the device progresses through the process. :+1:t2:

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False advertising on their site it appears.

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I may be wrong, but as far as I’m aware, Roon Labs charges no “licensing fees” to manufacturers who submit devices for Roon Ready certification. The devices are not returned, but that’s not the same as paying a licensing fee.

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@David_Snyder - Agree that “licensing fees” may not be the correct term, perhaps a difference in semantics.

@support - Why not allow use of devices pending certification so consumers aren’t inconvenienced by the certification queue length? Even a disclaimer would be acceptable when enabling a “Pending Certification” device that states that the device has that status and may not function as desired.

Support will not be in until Tuesday now.

Sorry to say the certification process doesn’t work that way, Roon may have the devices at their offices, but each device must pass its own certification and until that happens, they will not be flagged as Roon Ready.

Manufacturers have been doing this for a long time and it is why Roon locked the process down two years ago. If you read the threads you will see a lot of claims of Roon ready pending, but that is not Roon’s fault.

All devices that are Roon Ready are shared on the Roon’s partner page and until that happens, never believe anything.

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@Michael_Harris - I very much appreciate the insight. Might you know how long the certification process takes or if there is any transparency into status? Unfortunately, I don’t understand what part of the process would prevent using the device whilst in the certification queue. I understand if the manufacturer has not yet sent the device to Roon, but once it is in Roon’s hand, are we simply to wait indefinitely? That does not seem reasonable to me.

Hegel took three years to get their first device certified.
There is no average time for certification as it depends on the test, redevelop cycle between roon and the manufacturer (and any third parties the manufacturer is using for hardware and software development)

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Some take a long time, but given that your supplier already has Roon certified device’s though they are all currently DACs. Only one of them, the Stream-IF is Roon Ready, the othe are Roon tested so work over AirPlay or Chromecast.

With Hegel they never had a Roon Ready device and had to rebuild theirs more than once.

Have you looked at Chromecast or AirPlay settings within Roon? I’m just having a quick look at the web page at the moment.

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I have a workaround now with a direct connect via USB cable. I am told that this is sonically better, and it does sound spectacular, but I was unable to compare against the network option. Thanks again for the intel @Michael_Harris .

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No problem at all and glad you have something working
update us when it is Roon Ready as others might be quite interested in the results.
For tonight just enjoy the music

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Hi @thd99.999,

There’s quite a bit of speculation in some of your statements regarding certification in this thread and I’m going to kindly ask that you stop thinking out loud as if your statements are fact. I’ve moderated your posts accordingly and appreciate your cooperation moving forward.

Roon is not paid a licensing fee for Roon Ready status. Your moderated statements to that effect are entirely inaccurate. We are provided with two pieces of gear to test in the certification process. Those devices are retained by Roon in our equipment library. When customers report an issue with a Roon Ready or Roon Tested device they are pulled and bench-tested by our Hardware Expert. If the issue can be reproduced a ticket is put in for the problem. This happened just today with reports regarding Devialet gear.

Additionally, Roon does not allow gear that is in the certification process to function as Roon Ready in the interim. That hasn’t turned out well in the past and we don’t want to revisit those days, you may not realize it but you don’t want a replay of that either. You can trust us on that.

Generally, we can’t comment on certification progress. Certification is a collaboration between two companies and requires testing + technical feedback from both our end and the other company. Rarely has a piece of equipment for certification reached us with absolutely no issues that need to be smoothed away. We handle certification the way we do based on experience.

If you reach out directly to the manufacturer, they might be able to provide some more details of how certification is going on their end, but on our end, the answer here will always be the same - the device will only be certified once it’s ready and passes all the necessary checks.

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Hi @jamie,

What you’ll find in my posts are not speculation but questions specific to your process because as a consumer, I am being denied access to a feature I expect to work as advertised. If it was falsely advertised by the manufacturer, then Roon, not me, should contact the manufacturer to defend your brand and rights. I shall have no part it that. I have already contacted the manufacturer about my specific transaction. What I suggested, and a suggestion is not speculation, was a way to minimize the inconvenience to consumers during the process. While it is your right to withhold information (queue length, etc.) that might be useful to consumers, it is in my opinion a disservice to them. I might wait two weeks for certification and keep your products/services, but I won’t wait three years. That’s something I feel the consumer should decide, not Roon behind a veil of secrecy. But that’s Roon’s choice, and you have made it.

I was prepared to go on merrily and use the USB connection as a work-around however this latest post adds to a previous issue with Roon licensing leaving me piqued. Consequently, I’ll schedule the return of the hardware I purchased and cancel my subscription. Because as a consumer, that is my choice.

How long it takes for a device to get certified, depends for a large part on the manufacturer of the device itself. Since Roon doesn’t have any control over that, it would be unwise for them to speculate otherwise.

The same goes for the manufacturer itself. They can’t be sure exactly how long it will take for the device to get certified, as they rely in part on Roon. In that same logic, it is unwise for a manufacturer to claim Roon Ready certification when in fact it is not yet so. It’s called lying. plain and simple.

It’s good that you reached out to the manufacturer and filed a complaint. You bought a device based on statements that are not true. Given the uncertainty about how long it would take, my advice is to just get a full refund and a) wait for the device to get certified or b) buy one that actually is.

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I certainly agree with this and am curious how actively Roon is combatting this. I suppose it’s a fine line to walk as they don’t want to lose any partners, but this is also hurting their own business.

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What would hurt Roon’s business is when devices with broken Roon Ready implementations appear in the field … guess who gets the blame.

In these cases it is basically always the device vendor to blame: Roon Ready certification is well documented, both from a technical perspective and process wise.

The only thing I’m wondering if it wouldn’t be better to remove the message that Roon shows right now. Maybe it’s better to disable it completely: the device just won’t work and it’s up to the manufacturer to resolve this.

disclaimer: I’ve done Roon Ready integrations.

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You probably misunderstood my quote. I totally agree with Roon only certifying devices when they’re ready. I simply expressed the hope that Roon would take action against companies that advertise devices as Roon Ready when in fact they’re not (yet).

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I know. I’m using one of those right now. FYI it’s amazing!

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Hi there,

The length of time per certification varies wildly depending on multiple factors. We’ve found that it’s a really bad idea to put timetables on certifications given that there are so many elements outside of our control. Sometimes the issues we find don’t even allow for the device to be enabled or played to. This sets up an extremely negative experience for our users and it’s negative experiences that the partner’s program is meant to prevent.

Right now we are waiting on firmware after having completed our first round of testing. Once we receive the new firmware, I’ll ask our team to give Playback Designs priority. They are known for their great products/great work and will hopefully resolve the issues we identified in our testing the first time around!

Best wishes,

Wes
Roon Partners Team

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Thanks much @Wes . Your response is much better aligned with what I would expect from Roon. Thank you again for this additional clarification and your professionalism. I will certainly reconsider my return now, and please don’t prioritize on my account as the USB direct work-around does a fine job. Perhaps others waiting could also use that method during the certification process. Cheers, Marc

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Hi @thd99.999, my comment about there being speculation in your post is in reference to the quote below.

As I clarified, your statement is inaccurate. We are not paid any licensing fees for Roon Ready status. There is a certification process involved that requires hands-on testing by our Hardware Expert. Once testing is completed successfully the device is certified, Roon certification is not, and never has been, achieved by the manufacturer paying us a fee. We’d appreciate it if you would refrain from saying otherwise. Thanks in advance for your cooperation. :pray:t2:

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