Matching metadata of King Crimson boxed sets

[Joe_Strain]

I fully realize that this is in the wrong section, but, a new topic button didn’t pop up for me in the Metadata section, for some reason, and the help article was about as useful in solving my issue as scraping a nail over my eyes (sorry, Roon-folk…a slight exaggeration for effect).

In any case, for the King Crimson fans in here, how are you handling Roon’s identification of the various, massive “album era” boxed sets??

As of right now, I’ve got each individual disc as a stand-alone, with the date and city listed in the “Version” section so that this information is visible to me under the ALBUM section. I also have the disc itself as the album cover so that I can see the disc number, the venue, and the date.

It works alright, but, it’s really unwieldy, as I’ve got such an overwhelming about of individual entries, between the Starless, Return to Red, Thrak, On & Off the Road, and Heaven & Earth sets.

The main issue here is that if I choose to identify them, they get collected into a set, but, each disc within a set unfortunately loses all individual identification & location data, meaning, even if the tracks match, the location isn’t, say, listed in parentheses after each individual song title, so, I just end up with 100 tracks where it’s the same 5-7 songs for that tour listed in an endless list.

I apologize if I’m not making much sense there, but, I’m probably too in the weeds on this, at the moment. I hope someone understands what I mean. Please let me know how all of you Crim fans have these great sets represented in your libraries. I greatly appreciate any help. Thank you!

[Rugby (aka Daniel or Big Dan)]

I dont have those sets, but I do as you do, keep them as individual releases, add the box set info in the version information. I dont have enough box sets of one artist to do more, BUT, if I did I would use the tag systemto create a browsable view.

Example. Create a Starless Box Set tag and add to the albums in that box set. Create a Thrake box set tag, and add to those albums. Then create a King Crimson box set tag and add those Tags, not albums but Tsgs themselves to this master box set tag

Then when you view that master tags the individual box set tags will be displayed. Then set the master tag as a bookmark. It might work for you give it a test with just a few.

[Joe_Strain]

Hi Daniel,

I appreciate the prompt reply. Tags & Bookmarks…I’ve heard those terms associated with Roon for years now, but, have not used either before. I’m going to need to do a bit of homework in order to familiarize myself with both Tags & Bookmarks before I try anything there, but, I’m grateful for the suggestion.

[Mike_O_Neill]

A Roon Tag is “static” oneself set any change is manually done so ideal for box sets that doesn’t change

If you create several tags of say 5 albums each, you can then create a “tag of tags” say King Crimson Boxes

Have a play it’s easy.

Bookmarks are a bit more complex , if you go to albums , use the Focus tool to limit to King Crimson and then save it as a Bookmark , then later add more King Crimson they will be included in the Bookmark, ie it’s Dynamic

Read the KB

Tags

[Joe_Strain]

Thanks for the reply, Mike.

Just to be clear, this method creates a controllable, self-defined category-based view, of sorts, however, in the “Albums” section, the discs will still all be individually represented, correct?

I think it’s important that I point out that each one of these boxed sets houses over twenty discs each. Not sure how that affects what you’re proposing here.

As I said, I’ll need to do some homework here, and, well, that’s on me. These terms are being tossed around as though they are commonplace, and I’m admittedly having trouble wrapping my brain around the concepts and what it is that I’d be accomplishing by using them.

I’m certain these are great tools, but, from the outside, at first blush, it feels a bit like I would be adding unnecessary branching hallways to a pathway which should be straight.

[Jazzfan_NJ (Listening to JAZZ since 1972!)]

@Joe_Strain

The main issue here is that if I choose to identify them, they get collected into a set, but, each disc within a set unfortunately loses all individual identification & location data, meaning, even if the tracks match, the location isn’t, say, listed in parentheses after each individual song title, so, I just end up with 100 tracks where it’s the same 5-7 songs for that tour listed in an endless list.

I feel your pain. This is a fault of the metadata being provided to Roon. The more robust the metadata the better Roon will work. In the case of many King Crimson box sets, such as “Starless”, the metadata simply shows the song titles with no recording locations. The ways that Roon can use the information contained in metadata often far outstrips the information in the metadata that is provided to Roon. Basically Roon is way ahead of the curve on the usefulness of metadata so I guess that we have to wait for the metadata providers to provide more detailed metadata.

[Rugby (aka Daniel or Big Dan)]

Step 1. Create a Tag called Starless Box Set and add all the albums in the Starless Box Set to it.
Step 2. Create a Tag called Track Box Set and all all the albums in the Thrak Box Set to it.

So as an example, in my Tags I have created and added albums to a Be Bop Deluxe Live in the Air Age Box Set Tag and a Hammock Box Set Tag. Then I’ve gone to the Tag screen and you can see them both there circled in red below.

Step 3. Click at the Top of the Tags Screen, the My Tags and choose the +New Tag option at the bottom and create a “King Crimson Box Sets” Tag.
Step4. Go into the Starless Box Set Tag, click on the 3 dot menu, Click Add to Tag, Choose the King Crimson Box Set Tag. Then so the same for the Thrak box set Tag.

In the end you will have on the main screen a Tag call “King Crimson Box Sets” with both other Tagged Box Sets underneath. In my example below you can see circled in red the “My Box Sets” tag.

If you then open the “King Crimson Box Sets” Tag, you would see a screen with each individual Box set shown.

In my example, when I go into the My Box Sets Tag I see this…

At this point while you are in the Box Set tag, you can click on the bookmark icon in the top right,
Create a bookmark call King Crimson Box Sets. Thereafter, any time you go into Roon, you can just click on that Bookmark and it will take you straight to the King Crimson Box Sets Tag.

[Joe_Strain]

Hey Daniel,

Thanks for taking time out of your busy day to share such a detailed response. I appreciate everyone who responded. I’ve been a Roon user on for seven or eight years now and never really used any of these more advanced tools before. Thanks for having patience with a novice here.

[Mike_O_Neill]

I don’t have many examples , this is one

1. Each Album appears as a Single album in album view

2. The Tag shows all 19 albums (many off screen in this shot)

3. The whole Tag appears in another Tag Bach Organ Works alongside conventional Box sets (The Alard and Suzuki sets are other examples where the full set is work in progress with the artist)

Does that make more sense ?

Roon has been promising a rework of how it handles box sets but that was 18 months ago and still nothing has materialized. Box sets are definitely a weakness in Roon, especially if you split the box into it’s component original albums.

First prize is a box set where each disc has individual artwork and metadata, and is show much like a Tag , this seems to be evading the developers

This how I would expect it to look, this is a 114 CD set, shown here in JRiver