Bluesound Node 2i to miniDSP SHD with coax connection
Description of Issue
I have three Node 2i streamers. When I try to play 24/192 tracks from Qobuz, one of my Node 2i devices will not output sound, even though the BluOS controller indicates that they’re playing. When I group my Nodes in Roon, the other Nodes play 24/192 tracks just fine, but one does not. The problem is intermittent. At times, I’ll hear audio, but it’s infrequent.
I have tried ungrouping the devices, logging out of Qobuz in the BluOS app and logging back in, changing the streaming quality in the BluOS app from 24/192 to 24/96 and then back again, removing the device from Roon, factory resetting the Node etc.
Playing tracks at 24/96 or lower works just fine and so does changing the Roon sample rate conversion to something lower than 24/192. When I successfully get audio output at 24/192 with some of these methods, it’s short-lived, and the problem keeps coming back. I’d be grateful for any suggestions.
Not sure if this would help but try swapping coax cables? Could be a faulty connector?
Also, can you swap streamer positions (assuming they are all the same)? Put the known “good” one where the one with issues is? Just to see if its the streamer or the location in the net that is the issue?
Is there firmware for these? Are they all on the same firmware?
Are they all the same age? Are they all the same release version/model year?
MiniDSP SHD is supposed to be Roon Ready b y itself. Does it work if you stream directly to it? Or is it one of the Nodes that’s not playing? Does Node’s own DAC work?
I believe the SHD only runs internally at 96/24 so perhaps its down converter is broken via spdif or it only accepts upto 96/24 using it? Sounds like it if it works at 96/24 or lower this is your issue not Roon. Your using the node as the Roon device and by using coax Roon wont have any idea of the ongoing dac your using or its capabilities.
Thank you for the great suggestions @bearFNF. I swapped out the coax cables. Seemed to fix the problem for a time. Then it came back. I tried swapping the streamers, but the problem (in the original room–not the device) persists. There is firmware. All firmware is up to date and the same. They are all roughly about the same age (within a year of each other). To address some other suggestions (thanks everyone!), @Stephen_Horvath I’m using a switch but the problem remains even when I go directly from the wall. @Boris_Molodyi The miniDSP SHD is Roon Ready and I can stream the 24/192 tracks to it, but it downgrades (not sure of the term) to 24/96. I haven’t tried the Node’s DAC in part because the SHD would just covert it again (D/A/D/A) to process Dirac Live if I use dual RCAs out from the Node. @Simon_Arnold3 yes, the SHD runs internally at 24/96 but it is supposed to “accept” 24/192 from an external device, and it does, at least intermittently, with my Node(s).
Another interesting thing here: when the Node(s) can play 24/192 successfully, sometimes I will try to group it with other devices in Roon, and everything runs great. Other times, grouping devices causes the individual Node that was just working well to stop outputting sound again. When I group devices and everything is working well, I might be able to play a different album or even a few different ones, but eventually, I lose sound again.
Thanks so much for all the suggestions. Please offer others if you have them!
I stream exclusively from Roon, so I hope others will continue to offer suggestions if they have them. I’m not clear on why it’s an issue to have this thread in Support. Are you suggesting it should move to a different section of the community or removed entirely? If Roon support can review my logs to rule out a Roon issue, I’d appreciate that.
So it could be a problem with the SHD, with Node, or with the cable. I believe, from a quick look at the specs page, SHD should accept up to 216 (not that anyone were doing it) from external inputs.
I’m just trying to understand why are you going the Node → SHD route. If you want to use Dirac in the SHD, it will downsample to the resolution it can process whether you are streaming to the Roon Ready network port, or to Node and then to the coax input; you just won’t see that in Roon’s signal path since it won’t know anything happening once the signal leaves the Node. But the end result should be the same (and really, I very much doubt that anyone could distinguish straight 24/192 and downsampled to 24/96 signal either way; it might downsample to 24/48 for Dirac anyway, although I am not 100% certain here, but even that should be better than what anyone can hear).
If you have something else you could test with, it might be interesting to a) feed SHD with a known good 24/192 signal from something other than Node, and b) to feed Node’s 24/192 output to something other than SHD to determine where the breakdown occurs. But for practical purposes, since you’re only using Roon (and not e.g. BluOS streaming) I’d just connect SHD to the network and use it directly. Only difference would be a more accurate signal path display in Roon.
This is not a criticism of you, but just because you use Roon as your exclusive means of music playback does not entail that Support is tasked with helping you troubleshoot your entire system. That applies to everyone. Especially as Support is overburdened and understaffed as it stands.
The issue here is that S/PDIF is outside of the RAAT chain of custody. That makes this a Bluesound or miniDSP issue, not a Roon issue.
Moderators can move this thread to the Audio Gear Talk section.
It’s a good question @Boris_Molodyi–I’m using the Node because the SHD is a dual-purpose processor that allows me to use Dirac for both HiFi and home theater applications. The SHD has no home theater bypass option, so if I use the SHD for streaming, I’d have to adjust the volume of the SHD a lot each time I move from one system to the other. I tried to make this work for a month, but it’s inconvenient and a “blow out speakers” problem waiting to happen if I forget to adjust the SHD volume each time I change inputs. I also prefer the BluOS interface/experience to Volumio when I need to make adjustments to settings.
I’m honestly not too concerned about the streaming rates. The primary issues for me are 1) adding albums quickly from Qobuz or Tidal in Roon means I end up with a lot of content that just happens to be 24/192, and if they won’t play (or at least output audio), it’s time consuming to go through each album and change the versions, 2) I’d prefer not to use Muse at all, if I can avoid it, and 3) if something is broken, I’d like to know what it is and fix it, if possible.
And it’s a good suggestion to try a different streamer with the SHD. I might order a Wiim at some point to test it out.
You are welcome to ignore this entire thread and browse elsewhere if you find the content so objectionable. I find it extremely difficult to get any response from support staff on the rare occasions in which I do request help for Roon-related issues, so tying them up with a log check seems pretty unlikely (although I would certainly appreciate their input if I could get it).
I am quite grateful to the community members who offered their thoughts and suggestions and would welcome other helpful ideas.
For anyone experiencing a similar issue, setting Roon max streaming quality for Qobuz to 24/96 allows the “problem” device to play flawlessley on its own or in groups. I prefer this to using Muse sample rate conversion or changing all album versions to 24/96 manually, and this also eliminates the green light or other annoying additions in Roon’s signal path. Thanks again to the folks who offered their insights.
Ah, makes sense. I don’t know if SHD has the ability to apply volume offsets to different inputs, if it does that might be one way to work around this. Maybe you could also use Roon’s volume limiter?
Absolutely. It is supposed to work, so something is broken somewhere…
The SHD has presets that allow you to make per-speaker adjustments (which is great for the initial 2.2 calibration but potentially a can of worms after that’s been done already). Unfortunately, it doesn’t allow for input-specific volume defaults, which I don’t understand, because it seems like it would be easy to program for a device like the SHD.
Even then, I don’t entirely trust that input-specific volume defaults would be reliable, and one software glitch could do some real damage to my speakers. I like being able to use the SHD just as a processor, and keeping it at one volume gives me peace of mind. I have similar concerns about using the Roon volume limiter because of the potential for an inadvertent toggle off.
Having a separate streamer and volume control has been a much better user experience (aside from the weird 192 issue that is relatively minor in the grand scheme of things), especially since I use several other Bluesound devices.
I’ve moved this to Audio Gear Talk where it can remain open as a signpost for other users to engage in fruitful discussion.
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I have duplicated this issue with multiple external streamers (different Nodes and WiiM Pro Plus), with coax and optical cables, with Tidal and Qobuz and the intermittent “no sound” at 24/192 problem persists.This seems to pinpoint the SHD as the culprit. I’m hoping some SHD users (and other tech savvy folks) will weigh in here. miniDSP support has not been responsive.