My Roon review after 10days

Audiophilia is a niche within a niche. I’d be surprised if it were worth more than a small fraction of Apple’s iWatch replacement band business. RoonLabs knows that, and seem to be content being the big fish in that pond.

Yes and no - show me the way to the next Ravenna-powered playback device. Or to the sane uPnP setup. Now, if we look at the current state of the CE field (and that includes in-vehicle), what you’re describing hasn’t happened, and much the contrary, seems to be going in the exact opposite direction: you have devices that support all the damn protocols (even if that means running on questionably sane software platforms, yes, I’m looking at you, Audio Pro). As long as it’s relatively cheap to do so, I’d love to hear why a sane manufacturer wouldn’t do just that if they aren’t subjected to strong-arm tactics.

Yes. Exactly at 1Gb/s.

Historically, yes, it’s a niche. But if there’s one guarantee in technology it’s that it will get better and cheaper in the future. Hi-res audio will be one way it gets better for the mainstream and people will expect it even if they don’t care right now. Imagine someone trying to sell a TV today that doesn’t support 1080p video.

Now, if we look at the current state of the CE field (and that includes in-vehicle), what you’re describing hasn’t happened, and much the contrary, seems to be going in the exact opposite direction: you have devices that support all the damn protocols

What do you mean? There’s only one Bluetooth, one WiFi, one HDMI, etc.

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Absolutely !

I always kinda saw Roon as playing Microsoft to relatively niche hardware manufacturers whom experience has shown don’t really have the ressources to develop anything passable in-house, and giving them a unified, usable platform, while dealing with some of the support burden. Maybe I’m very naïve, but I just don’t see the world-domination gambit in what they’re doing.

I really don’t want to get into an MQA argument, but that kinda sounds a lot like BS’s thinking. And yeah, maybe people will want to stream DSD256 to their cars, or maybe they’ll understand that it doesn’t make a damn difference because there’s so much road noise. Maybe software providers (looking at you, @flak) will figure out a way for it to make actual sense, who the hell knows. Maybe you’re right, and all those things will happen, and Roon is positioning for a buyout on the day that happens, but from the perspective of a hardware manufacturer: why stick to RAAT only, and not just integrate AirPlay 4 or Chromecast 12.3.593b72 “Genmaicha” on your device that’ll have more than enough memory and computing power to do all those things ?

There’s one ChromeCast, one AirPlay… that’s where RAAT fits in.

Or, you know, disappear completely.

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Ok cool.

Are all your wireless endpoints connected to this same router (which is hardwired to your NUC Roon Core) ? i.e. you have only this one wireless access point at home?

Or you have multiple wireless access points? If multiple, what models and how do they connect to your main modem/router? Are they hardwired to the main modem/router? Or have you got them wirelessly connected to your main modem/router - and if this, how many ‘hops’?

I use one endpoint. The other ones were more for test purpose.
I have only one access point which the router. I just have two gigabit switches.

I use wifi only if I don’t have the choice. Like iPad, iPhone, Macbook as well.
But all my other devices are hardwired. HC amplifier, Blu-ray player, Apple TV, NUC, NAS…

Honestly, I don’t think it’s a network issue.

I saw you mentioned the iPad app is ok now:

Did you report the iPhone and Mac app crashing to Support? So they can have a look into it?

Or is that ok now too?

The iPad application crashed again. So it’s not fixed. I have to add a comment in this thread.

About the Mac application, I won’t use it regularly. I installed the bridge application, just in case.

No worries but you should at least tag @support for their help.

Occasionally I have to reboot my iPad. It happens, very rarely I have to shut apps down, it happens. This sometimes happens with the Roon app, but it always comes back exactly where I left it.
If you look for faults in anything, you will find it. Equally, if you look for what’s great, you will find that too.
Of course, any faults should be reported to support so they can make the good experience better for everyone.

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A lot of interesting points in this discussion, and I don’t have much to add. But…

Not sure this is a valid comparison*. Almost everyone with normal or corrected vision can easily see the difference in HD v. SD TV. Not many can hear the difference between CD and high-resolution audio. Heck, many (most?) can’t hear the difference between 320K mp3 and CD.

It amuses me to see people obsessing about getting the little blue MQA light on their DAC lit up to confirm they are hearing the improved sound quality. They don’t complain about the sound quality, just the missing blue light.

Or better yet, the people desperately trying to get bit perfect playback from Amazon hi-res. Some claim massive SQ improvement by setting their PC/Mac sound card to max 24/192 resampling for “bit perfect” playback. Others wonder if they are getting hi-res SQ through their Firestick, iPhone, Apple TV, etc. They’re not, but apparently they can’t tell just by listening. Then there are those who hear massive SQ improvement on their Echo Dot for $5 extra per month.

I confess that I am sometimes sitting around reading and something really good sounding comes on roon shuffle/radio play, and I will glance up to see if it is a Qobuz 24/96 track. More often than not, it’s a 16/44.1 track that just happens to be exceptionally well produced, recorded and mastered.

Anyway, if we can’t hear it, does it matter?

(*Edit: it IS a valid comparison in terms of the selling part.)

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I’d buy one at the right price for the right location as I hardly ever watch TV actively and don’t often bother putting my glasses on. I can half watch and work out what’s going on from the sound and dialog. It’s not much of a stretch in Midsummer Murders, Vera or Poirot :joy: I don’t need 1080p for the news :joy:
You can tell I’m not a movie buff.

While we’re talking names, it looks like Roon were probably right to reject my suggestion for Roon Bridge - RAAT Catcher.

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The power of marketing: concentrate on the blue light, not the SQ.

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Gotta love the sound quality though. The blue light means you are getting what you paid for and your network is 100%

How about RAAT TRAP.

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This is a good point. However, I’m old enough to remember when HD was new and people said it was unnecessary because TV picture quality is fine and the first HD TVs weren’t as good as they are now.

People listen to music on poor quality headphones and speakers with low quality DACs. The quality of those will also increase (and get less expensive) so people will have better equipment and will be more likely to notice the difference.

Also, marketing will convince people they need hi-res and people will be looking for that blue light. :grinning:

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Ain’t gonna happen… Do you see any marketing or competitive pressure on Spotify, Apple Music etc to offer hi res or even CD quality music?

The only reason Tidal has the market share it does, is because of Jay Z, and the marketing of hip hop. Not because of the marketing higher quality music. While Qobuz and Deezer etc are not even on the mainstream radar.

The Apple HomePod tried to market higher fidelity in a more expensive speaker. It failed.

The fact is, the mainstream consumer push is going to be in the direction of convenience, convergence and features, with adequate or “good enough” SQ.

Between mono/single smart speakers and home theater setups, most people have never experienced true sound stage and imaging, and will never seek it out or pay for it.

Beats and Bose Noise Cancelling headphones etc will always be the epitome of high end audio for most folks

What are you talking about? Apple Music is offering Hi Res in Apple Music.