No sound from MQA files with HQPlayer

It’s not working for me.
When I switch on “SDM Pack”, I get no sound (although Roon indicates the track is playing DSD). When I switch that feature off (“none”) I get sound back but now I’m playing PCM.

I’d need to see screenshots of all your settings when it’s not working. Otherwise can be hard (impossible) to figure out.

For macOS, you do need to select DoP (DSD over PCM). And it will be limited to DSD128. That’s an OS limitation.

OK, I picked a combination of settings (including DoP) that will play a native DSD file, and at least 1 other (not DSD) track, with Roon showing DSD playback. But then I get no sound output for an MQA track I tried. Seems I’m into a game of whack-a-mole.

Time to eat something and go mow the grass.

Problem here is that most DACs don’t support DSD at multiples of 48 kHz, only at multiples of 44.1 kHz (for what ever incomprehensible reason). While with PCM they do support both multiples of 44.1k and 48k.

OK, next layer or challenges is that all filters cannot convert between these two rate families. closed-form being one example of such.

So how to deal with the issue:

  1. For starters, under SDM Defaults, set oversampling filters to poly-sinc-lp-2s (you can change later with assistance of the table in the manual)
  2. Select 44.1k x512 as Bit rate limit (assuming your output can do DSD512 with DoP, which I doubt a little, but doesn’t matter here since other settings are suitable)

This should give you sound with those MQA tracks that are using 48k-base rates. So essentially it is all up to (1), because other settings are set in suitable way.

If you know for certain, that your DAC supports DSD also at multiples of 48k, there’s the additional check box “48k DSD” to white-list those rates. And then you can leave the rate limit at 48k x512 as well.

Essentially in this case the logic goes: Roon sends stream at 48k rate multiple -> closed-form filter can do only conversions to 2^x ratios -> 48k DSD is not allowed so such rates are not available -> there’s no solution to play.

Even if you manage to send 48k-base DSD to many DACs using DoP, they just tend to go silent.

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Still no sound from MQA tracks with those settings.

OK! Finally got it to work.

Can your Mac do double the SDM sample rate, for DSD128 output ?

Apparently, yes my Mac Mini system can go to DSD128.

At DSD256 I get no sound from an MQA track.
But I do from a FLAC 44.1kHz 16 bit CD.
Processing speed: 3.3X to 4X .
At DSD128 I get no processing speed display; I understand this means it is better than 99x at that setting.

So far, nothing is quite hitting me over the head saying “You’ve gotta have this!” There are times I think I’m hearing better soundstaging, “more air”, or something, with the HQP set-up, but I’m not confident this isn’t either a placebo effect or particular to the recording. It’d be hard to set up a true, rapid-fire A-B test.

As for the MQA aspect of this thread, I’m not committed to MQA per se, it’s just that I’ve found a number of artists/albums that happen to be recorded that way. I don’t want to have to go back and forth with software settings every time I play one. Another virtue of MQA is that it gives me a body of work that is recorded in a relatively consistent high quality way for purposes of speaker placement, room acoustic testing and tweaking, etc.

The real “first-world problem” I’m trying to address: my system sounds great for small-scale arrangements of acoustic instruments, voice, or electronica. I get a well-focused center image, decent bass, nice tone. Female vocals sound great. But for more complex, large-scale arrangements (symphonic music) I’m not as satisfied with the soundstage and imaging.

Is that the processing rate in Roon’s signal path?

If so, I assume that’s for Roon doing up-sampling to DSD128, not HQPlayer?

When using HQPlayer, it’s best to turn off Roon’s DSP, instead of ‘doubling up’. In this case, you don’t get any processing rate showing in Roon’s signal path as Roon. That’s normal.

Yes, that is the processing rate that Roon displays when I click on its Signal Path icon. And what I reported above was with Roon’s “Sample Rate Conversion” enabled. If I disable that in Roon, then I get no sound on the same non-MQA track. But if I then go into HQP and set “Bit Rate/Limit” (under “SDM Defaults”) down to 44.1k x128, then I get sound again. Here is the HQP setting now:

Noted, so that’s not HQPlayer. Just wanted to double check.

That’s the ticket. What’s your Roon signal path showing with this? Should show HQPlayer’s DSD128 output? And does your Peachtree also indicate incoming sample rate as DSD128?

Give the filter Jussi suggested above a try - poly-sinc-lp-2s.

And try with the ASDM7 modulator.

Roon signal path (for same recording reported above):

Looks fine.

Roon can actually control HQPlayer’s volume which allows you to disable Roon’s volume levelling.

You can change your ‘Vol Min’ to -30dB (just an example), so you have a good range of -30dB to -6dB to play with.

If you want the volume to be levelled automatically then you can leave Roon’s volume levelling on.

I don’t know how to display the incoming sample rate for the Peachtree amp. I’m playing everything through Roon. The Peachtree Nova 150 does not have its own display for file metadata, etc.

I wonder if it’s normal to hear an overall reduction in gain while using HQP. I’m jacking the volume controll up 1 or 2 dits. And for the first time ever I’m using Roon volume leveling. Well, that’s partly because I’m now playing a DSD classical recording with a relatively wide dynamic range (17 units). It sounds great. Whether that’s all from HQP per se, I still haven’t decided. This is a DSD recording of Jascha Heifetz playing Tschaikovsky (violin D maj op 35) with the CSO. Wide soundstage, focused central image, all good.

Roon volume levelling is obviously dropping volume, so that’s one reason you’re having to up the volume of your Peachtree.

And yes HQPlayer is also dropping volume (that’s the -6dB Vol Max setting you have). But that is essential for HQPlayer’s up-sampling DSP… (to avoid clipping).

If I were you, I’d turn off Roon’s volume levelling and leave HQPlayer volume at -6dB and use the physical remote control of the Peachtree for volume adjustments…

I’ve been mucking around with HQPlayer for over a week now. I’ve also been delving into room equalization with REW, and with Roon convolution. Meanwhile, I’ve been researching network audio adapters and linear power supplies (with support for HQP in mind). Tentative conclusions? If I were to add a new source to replace/augment my Bluesound Node 2i, then the best combination of SQ, functionality, and price (for my system, my room, and my ears) seems to be an iOS device plugged directly into my Peachtree Nova 150 via lightning to USB. This gives me SQ at least equal to what I seem to be getting from HQP. It gives me a built in Roon display, physical remote control (with the Peachtree IR remote), plus far less cable+device clutter, at much less expense, compared to the cost of an HQP license + NAA (like the ultraRendu) + linear power supply.

Now, I can’t know for sure if an ultraRendu + lps running HQP wouldn’t sound even better than my iPhone (with direct USB). It would cost me maybe $1500-$2K to find out. Meanwhile the iPhone sounds pretty darn good. I suspect that with asynchronous USB input into a decent DAC/Amp, the ultraRendu+HQP won’t add much if any audible value … for my ears … compared to what one already can do in Roon with upsampling and convolution. I’m open to being persuaded otherwise (to at least try out an NAA+lps) especially if someone can point to an objective A-B comparison (preferably with measurements).

I couldn’t resist ordering an ultraRendu and HQP license. Well, it sounds wonderful. YMMV.

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Pleased to hear it worked for you Tom !

I think the only reason your previous post didn’t get a response is because no one knows where to find what you were looking for. It may be that a combination of Archimago and CA threads is the best that can be done.

How would you describe the differences you are hearing ?

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I listened to some very familiar music in the past couple days, including the Beatles “1” album. I’m hearing a nice, clear separation of instruments on these and some other recordings. There may be less harshness in the high notes and better-defined bass compared to what had before the uRendu (or before settling into my current combination of HQP settings). Now, there could be some expectation bias going on. And I’m not set up to easily do real A-B testing. So, YMMV. These little gizmos are not inexpensive. But I have to say, I’m pleased. I’ve set HQP to feed my ESS 9018 DAC the maximum PCM sample rate it can handle (384 kHz) with the poly-sinc-ext filter. Nice sound stage. I’ve been trying DSD 128 as well, but it doesn’t necessarily sound better and takes a lot more horsepower.

Part of the satisfaction, admittedly, involves an OCD urge to tweek and tinker. For anyone who just wants an easy, plug-and-play path to good music, I still think an iOS device, straight into a Peachtree Nova (by USB-A with the amp’s “Dynec” noise reduction), is a good alternative. One thing I miss with HQP/NAA is support for a physical IR remote.

It does work. HQPlayer supports HID media keys, so any HID compliant remote works. For example I’ve tested with Mac Mini running Windows with BootCamp and the Apple IR remote works. However, on macOS, they’ve setup iTunes to always steal the HID media key presses. But on Windows and Linux it works.

There are various USB-connected IR/RF HTPC remotes on the market suitable for the purpose.