Would really appreciate your support on the below.
Many thanks
Best
Sven
Setup
Roon 1.4 (294) running on a MacMini (Mid 2010) with 8 GB running macOS Sierra 10.12.6 Server
MacMini is connected via LAN with two share points
a) QNAP TS-470 NAS with iTunes Mediathek
b) Naim HDX with all the files in Medium and High Quality
First Issue
From time to time I note that all albums get lost from the Naim HDX i.e. my album count gets down from >7200 to something around 4000. When I force a rescan of the share point, Roon adds them back. No idea why this happens.
Second Issue
Potentially related, Roon service / app stops. Usually noted as the iPad or iPhone won’t connect to the core.
Please let me know which additional information you need. I’d really like to sort this out.
Hi @Sven_Eschholz ----- Thank you for the report and sharing your feedback with us. The insight is very appreciated!
Moving froward, to help aide in our evaluation of the behaviors you’ve reported to us, may I very kindly ask you to please provide the following:
A screenshot of your “storage” tab in the application. I want to see how you’ve added your network shares.
The NAIM is the only share exhibiting this behavior consistently, correct? The QNAP always remains stable?
I just took a look at the NAIM website and I can see there is a variant of the HDX that comes with a SSD installed, is this the unit you are implementing?
Please describe how the mentioned storage devices (HDX and TS-470) are communicating with Roon/your network. Having detailed insight into any networking hardware you are implementing would be very appreciate.
In regard to your remotes, when you notice they are unable to connect is RoonServer stopping on the MacMini or does it continue to run?
My assumption is that the remotes eventually re-connect to the core machine at some point. Are you having to restart the core machine in order to achieve this OR do the connection seem to re-establish all by themselves?
Screenshot
Naim seems to show that behavior, but, to be honest, not 100% sure that the QNAP is always shown in room. No issues with Notebooks noted as the QNAP also holds shares used to store other data…
NAIM is HDD version, no SSD
Network communication via Ethernet Network to HP ProCurve Switch
Shares are mounted to the MacMini via SMB
Roon server is down, i.e. the application is no longer running. Have to restart the app. Is there a protocol I can send you which will hold the right information just before the close/crash of the moon server app (core) on the MacMini?
No connection problems noted if the server is up and running.
Hi @Sven_Eschholz ----- Thank you for the follow up and taking the time to answer my questions, the feedback is appreciated!
Moving forward, I have enabled diagnostics on your account as this action will automatically generate/upload a diagnostics report containing a set of your Roon logs to our servers the next time Roon is active on your core machine. Once we receive the report I will confirm that we have it and then will be passing over to our tech for evaluation so we can try to determine what could be the cause of these two issues with your setup.
Additionally, do you see any correlation between the crashes being experienced and the share being lost? In other words, does the share disappear AFTER a crash has happened?
Lastly, I did some research into the MacMini currently hosting RoonServer and it looks like there is no SSD in this device and it is also making use of a Intel Core 2 Duo processor (2.4GHz or 2.66GHz). My reason for bringing this up is that I am concerned that you could be experiencing performance issues as the mini is falling below our minimum requirements to run Roon.
Shares are still there and the only thing I need to do is, launch the Roon app again. That’s it.
The 2.66GHz MacMini has been upgraded for a 256GB SSD, pretty fast. Attached ScreenShot show Roon serving to 5 Roon clients (from Airplay to Roon-ready / RAAT). CPU usage is at 40%, seems okay.
Hi @Sven_Eschholz ----- Thank you for the follow up and taking the time to provide the requested feedback. Both are very appreciated!
I wanted to first let you know that I have received the mentioned diagnostics report and will be passing it over to our tech team for further analysis. Secondly, when the NAIM loses connection with the core device can the unit still be accessed (while in this state) from the OS level without issue?
Hi @Eric - a pleasure… really do want to sort it out - as a lifetime subscriber I am looking forward to long lasting fun
Thanks for passing on to the tech team.
Let me be clear, roon losses the connection. When opening the share point on the Mac via OS i.e. Finder, it’s still accessible. (Note: The Naim HDX is always on and never lost any connection - and can be accessed via Naim App all the time)
Hi @Sven_Eschholz ----- Thank you again for your continued feedback and more importantly for your patience while our team is looking into this behavior for you.
I checked on the status of your ticket today in our system to check on our tech team’s progress and I noticed that I have worded some of my data gathering questions to you a bit wrong (my apologies) and I wanted to just follow up so I can properly update my report. Please see below.
“Additionally, do you see any correlation between the crashes being experienced and the share being lost? In other words, does the share disappear AFTER a crash has happened?”
UPDATED: Additionally, do you see any correlation between the crashes being experienced and the album count depleting (“i.e. my album count gets down from >7200 to something around 4000”)? In other words, does the share disappear AFTER a crash has happened?"
Hi @Eric - as said, the sharepoint is still there. By the way, can’t see a real reason Roon should crash just because the sharepoint would not be available.
Have you guys now collected enough diagnostic data? As Roon keeps closing down on it’s own, I would expect you should have.
Thanks for the insight @Sven_Eschholz, very appreciated!
The mentioned diagnostics report was indeed received and is attached to your ticket, which I am currently waiting for feedback from the tech team on. As soon as I have an update on their analysis I wil be sure to reach out to you immediately. Thank you again for your continued patience!
Hi @Sven_Eschholz ----- Touching base with you because our tech team has asked me to gather some information to help aide in their evaluation of this behavior you are experiencing with your setup. Please see below. Thanks!
Further data gathering:
From your previous post you mentioned your storage devices (NAS and HDX) are communicating with your network/Roon via a HP ProCurve Switch. The team has asked if you could please expand on your description and provide us with the exact details of your network configuration/topology, being sure to also provide insight into any other additionally networking hardware you are currently implementing. The team would like to have a clear understanding as to how information is moving across your network and all the tools involved with making these connections possible.
The next time you encounter this error with the HDX would you kindly provide me with the following time stamps:
Timestamp #1 - When you notice that the album count has dropped.
Timestamp #2 - When you use force a rescan to restore the album count in Roon.
" From time to time I note that all albums get lost from the Naim HDX i.e. my album count gets down from >7200 to something around 4000. When I force a rescan of the share point, Roon adds them back. No idea why this happens.
will try to do so… meanwhile I started to think about changing the set-up. How do I actually transfer the set-up to a new server / machine respectively a NAS? Is there a set-up guide available?
Hi @Sven_Eschholz ----- Thanks for touching base with me, I will be sure to be on the look out for your feedback regarding my previous.
Our knowledge base has very good documentation on the type of procedure you are inquiring about. I pulled an article that should give you the answers you’re looking for
Network set-up
Unchanged set-up over the course of years with HP ProCurve in the cellar, connecting router and all devices per patch panel. All devices are connected via Ethernet Cable with 1GB set-up, where supported by hardware. Changes planned (but not yet implemented) are to have a music files on the QNAP NAS stored with an additional process synchronizing the HDX harddrive to the NAS. I.e. this would imply that Roon will scan/monitor the NAS instead of the HDX
Time stamps
Timestamp #1 noted drop in Roon album count 2018:02:10 08:17
Timestamp #2 rescan start with Roon starting to add albums back 2018:02:10 08:55
Hi @Sven_Eschholz ----- Thank you for touching base with me and providing the requested information. Both are appreciated!
Now that I have a sense when the error has occurred I have went ahead and enabled diagnostics on your account. What this actin will do is the next time the application is launched on your core machine a diagnostics report containing a set of Roon logs will automatically be generated/uploaded directly to our servers. I will confirm once it has been received and then swiftly pass the report over to our techs for analysis.
-Eric
UPDATE: Looks like we have received the report, passing over to the tech team for review.
Hi @Sven_Eschholz ---- Thank you again for your continued feedback and more importantly, thank you for your patience while our team has been looking into this behavior for you.
Continuing forward, our techs have updated your ticket and passed it back to me with the results from their log analysis. They have informed me that they can see the error occurring in the log traces but they are inconclusive in the sense that there is nothing indicating the “cause” of the error. In light of this the team has asked if you would kindly perform the following to try and isolate the issue:
Please temporarily disable the “iTunes” watch folder in the application.
example
As you did previously…The next time you encounter this error with the HDX would you kindly provide me with the following time stamps:
Timestamp #1 - When you notice that the album count has dropped.
Timestamp #2 - When you use force a rescan to restore the album count in Roon.
" From time to time I note that all albums get lost from the Naim HDX i.e. my album count gets down from >7200 to something around 4000. When I force a rescan of the share point, Roon adds them back. No idea why this happens.
I want to reassure you that the above configuration is only temporary and by no means do we expect the QNAP to be “left out” .
Just noted a crash of Roon this morning. Probably caused by switching of the Hugo 2 while streaming music to it.
2nd topic noted yesterday: could not stream Tidal songs… however, I didn’t encounter any network issues internally and external (via internet provider) as I was online and had full connectivity to the internet (120mbit high speed access).
After shut down and restart of roon, Tidal worked again. Strange…
Today I noted at 7:58 that album count dropped and Roon started rescan of the iTunes watch folder. This is the one on the QNAP. So will disable iTunes watch folder now.
