Roon database backup isn't working anymore [Fixed in b274]

Thanks a lot for your help and also for your prompt reply. Great job!!!

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Would it be possible to make the files visible again? I use a third party tool to sync the backups to different directories, and it seems I can’t point it to hidden files.

3 posts were merged into an existing topic: ROON Backup writing hidden files to disk drive which cannot be deleted

@support Is hiding the backup folder on Macs with MacOS 10.13 now a feature or a bug?
I have a visible backup folder with old backups up to 15.10.2017 and a hidden folder with first a dot in front and followed by the same folder name as the visible folder. This one contains all to newer backups including the one made with the latest Roon version (build 274).
Not really user friendly to occupy disk space without showing the files as a backup. Also the inconsistency of having 2 folders, one hidden, to me looks more like a bug than a feature. My Roon backup folder is on an external harddisk that is formatted with HFS Extended (Journaled).

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I am seeing the same behavior, running MacOS 10.13.1. I started clean after 274 and removed all backups, visible and hidden. When I created the first ‘Scheduled Backup’, a visible folder was created. Then, when I selected ‘Backup Now’, it wrote the backup to a newly created, hidden backup folder with the same name as the visible folder. If the intention was this hidden folder behavior, why?

@support

This thread has been quiet for four weeks but the last two posters raised a very legitimate question:

You have told Roon users that the Roon backup program is working just fine and that backups can be successfully restored from folders that do not show any content in Finder or in Roon. Instead, the backups are hidden in these folders. Unless you are using Terminal, there is not way to “see” the backups in these folders. This definitely seems like a bug to me – users should be able to see each and every backup that is in their folders, shouldn’t they? Why hasn’t this bug been addressed? Why haven’t these questions been answered? I, and others who are wondering if Roon’s backup feature is really working as intended, would like some answers.

It’s a feature / design choice and was introduced to discourage users from inappropriately selecting and risking corruption from outside Roon.

If you are happy with the later backups (in the hidden folder) you may remove this visible folder.

I don’t know know why the original folder was not just prefixed with a “.” to hide it. Maybe @support could comment on this.

@mike has given assurances… but it would be good to get an update from @Mike, I can only assume this migration issue will be addressed in the the next release.

Thanks for the response today clarifying that the hidden content in Roon’s backup files was an intended feature rather than a bug. It still seems less than satisfactory since you can’t see whether your file has been backed up. So I assume there will some sort of fix for this in a future update that will address all concerns. If there is an update from @Mike now, that would be great. Thanks!

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Yes, this change was by design, but we’ve got a lot of feedback on the change, and we’re going to be addressing this feedback for a future release.

Look for an improvement here soon, folks!

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I just ran some backups on the new Roon 1.4 and didn’t notice anything different about the backup process. In other words, the actual backup files are still hidden from view. Is a change still in the works?

Yes, we still plan on re-visiting this design. We just didn’t want to either delay the 1.4 release or add additional stress to the QA team. It’s on the list, but as always we can’t comment on the details of scheduling beyond that.

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Got it – thanks for the speedy response.

Not being able to locate my backups is still an issue for me. I’m not really understanding why this was considered a feature to begin with. I believe this thread was started back in October of last year, and there seems to be no “real” fix yet. We should be able to see them when we search using Find Backups and without using Terminal.

Thanks in advance for your attention and reply. Thank you

+1
I like to backup my roon backups on a NAS and this became cumbersome with this bug, sorry feature.

Its not even a feature. It is the worst possible user experience. Personally, I have wasted much time and energy looking for the backups, and then looking for a solution. It has not been promoted as a feature - or promoted at all (at least as told by the large number of users who felt they were having a "problem’) - so not sure Roon really believes it has value. If there is value to it, great, be transparent and tell everyone. Now that there has been considerable user pushback, make it a user decision. Provide flexibility so if you believe it has value and want to “hide” things, you can. If not, allow us to select the user experience or feature that is best for each of us!

Feel exactly the same!
To call it feature only transmits my frustration to the Mods answer Roon database backup isn't working anymore [Fixed in b274]

Please, @support fix this asap!

[fixed in b274]: Nothing is fixed here by b294. We have already 2018!

Hey folks,

I understand the frustration here, and I just want to reiterate that we have been listening to all the feedback and are in the process of addressing it.

There are a few known issues with our backup feature right now, and we’ve also heard the feedback about the hidden folders loud and clear. Work is already underway to resolve these issues, but I want to be 100% clear that we are not currently aware of any issues that can cause data loss or backup corruption.

Some of this confusion around this feature stems from the fact that your Roon backups are not simply stored inside the /RoonBackups folder – the archive is the entire /RoonBackups folder, and you really shouldn’t ever need to access any of the contents of that folder.

Roon should simply be pointed at the /RoonBackups folder to save or restore backups, but we know this experience could be clearer and we’re working to address that confusion.

While the underlying technical issues here are relatively simple, some changes made last year have had unintended consequences, and that’s what we’re addressing now. While the integrity of backup data was not at risk, I want to be clear that backups are something we take really seriously.

We appreciate everyone’s feedback. Thanks all!

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Thanks very much for this update. When I could have a wish, please make that every single backup can be backed up with a program that mirrors files. This way the backup process does not cumulatively grow over time, even if the music library stays the same as it is the case when backing up the Roon backup folder. Alternatively consider that each backup can be automatically done to two locations in the network or can this already be set like that?

Hi @streamy,

this is already possible. You can configure two or more “scheduled backups” and choose a different storage location and starting time for each backup. After you’ve finished the first configuration, you can just add another one (and so on), as you can see in my screenshot. Hope I could help.

Alternatively, you could use third-party folder syncing software (e.g. GoodSync), of course.