OK, I’ve been using roon now for a week or so and, while I love it, I’m wondering if I’ll keep it or not.
If I do, I think I need to rethink my system from the ground up.
I got a Linn Majik streamer with a Q-nap NAS TS-251, with 2x4TB HD’s (CPU: Intel®Celeron®CPUJl800@2.41GH & 1GB RAM) a few years ago and ripped all my CDs. I have about 13,000 ripped tracks on my NAS
I also have tidal
I have loads of random old albums in my iTunes library (some duplicates with the NAS)
My NAS sits directly behind the Linn in the living room, not ideal cos it’s quite noisy. and when running Linn Kazoo server it runs all the time! Hence removed that…
I saw from the thread that I should not install the roon core on the NAS spinning disc, but rather on a SSD.
So, I installed the Core on my iMac in the office upstairs - this is 4 GHz Intel Core i74 GHz Intel Core i7 with 32 GB ram. The iMac also has my iTunes library on a different 4TB external HD.
…however the iMac is connected to the Linn / NAS via an ethernet link over the Mains electricity.
…so… I’ve been told the roon core ‘reads’ the music both on my NAS, iTunes and Tidal - and the music drops out A LOT! - one reason suggested was that the core is too far away and calling from my Roon remote to the Core then the core calling the music and sending it to the Linn is an unneccsieary round trip.
NOW THE QUESTION
If I choose to keep Roon, I’m thinking of selling my NAS (OTT for what I need-I have regular backups on separate 4TB drives and also to cloud) and replacing it with two 4TB drives - one for my FLAC files the other for my iTunes
putting them both close to the Linn (and TV) in the living room.
Using an Mac Air with 500GB SSD to run roon core and iTunes.
1, How does where the Remote is cause dropouts?
2. I’ve run core on many machines including a Xeon in the cellar, without a problem.
3. Electricity moves at the speed of light, I doubt a matter of the square footage of your house could make enough difference to cause dropouts.
I understand the problem is not the remote - but my setup.
so I’m in my living room and use iPad / iPhone to create a play list - tidal, FLAC from NAS and/or iTunes upstairs and almost every track has a drop out.
the remote speaks to the roon core on the iMac upstairs, which then drags the file from the NAS upstairs to the core then back down the network to play on the Linn…
I understand speed of electricity - I’m a former electrical engineer…
A 2011 MBA is not going to be a great roon experience. Suggest you try the iMac downstairs and see if the dropouts still happen. But that might mean moving the nas too.
Power line Ethernet is a troublesome technology at best. Wifi is fine for control and can be workable sometimes
thanks Wizard, I’m leaning towards shifting everything downstairs - I’ll try WiFi network initially and if this doesn’t work, I’ll go for hard wired.
I’ll research NUC and ROCK a bit more - I see some suggest a Mac mini too…
iMac needs to stay upstairs in the office so can’t try that…
Joe
I think we are using Remote in different meanings. When I say Remote, I mean it in the sense it is used on the Roon Download page, i.e the iOS or Android app that can control Roon. In that sense a Remote couldn’t be causing dropouts. I think you are calling an endpoint a Remote.
Just trying to save you from rearranging your system. I have core, NAS and endpoints scattered all over sans dropouts. The NAS is in the basement, core is on a NUC in the living room, and my enpoints are all over. My Remote (used in the Roon download sense) is in whatever room I happen to be in.
Hi Slim
sorry for imprecise lanaguage - the drop outs all on my Linn DSM.
I get it that the dropouts not on the remotes - iPad iPhone etc…
I just played hotel California via roon to my Linn and it was unlistenable… dropping out every 10 or 15 seconds…
this is all feeling a bit too difficult… which is a great pity because I love the look and feel of roon!
Joe
first off I’m guessing, but is the issue your Mac to NAS connection of
…“however the iMac is connected to the Linn / NAS via an ethernet link over the Mains electricity.”
Is it impossible to fish a ethernet cable. ?
Second, I also use a Qnap, but a HS251, ( there is a newer model) and have it in the rack. Its fan-less. I have 2 4TB WD drives and because of the size also use it for other data storage other than my music library.
My set up is very much the same as yours, iMac i7, Sonore Rendu end point, NAS and Dac . Every thing is in the stereo rack but the iMac. Every thing is connected via ethernet using a Netgear GS108 switch, including a wireless router. Roon controlled buy either my iMac or iPad. As well I operate three zones in total.
The only difference in connectivity between my system and yours is the iMac to NAS connection using an ether net vs. electrical mains. ( yes I use a switch but shouldn’t make a difference.)
Perhaps you could get ur hands on a long ethernet cable just in order to connect Mac to NAS to trouble shoot and if needed fish the wire after.
That any help?
Let us know,
Joe - sorry for being so stupid, but I don’t understand what this means.
Ethernet means wired (with Ethernet cable), but when you say this I think you are talking about WiFI, or some sort of protocol, that uses your house wiring. If so, then that problematic for fidelity…
If that is what you’re doing, then can you use WiFI without involving anything going over your house wiring? Just as an experiment.
Slim.
Ethernet over mains is … dLAN® technology (direct Local Area Network) uses existing power cables in your home to transmit ethernet over mains electricity at speeds of up to 1200 Mbps,
Pretty sure that Joe is in England where an electrical wire is referred to as mains. I also think that’s his issue…
Steve
Aha, I originally read the term ‘Ethernet’ and thought no further.
Definitely the problem. Not the first time on this forum people have had trouble with such a setup.
At least, it isn’t the placement of the components of the system. That would go against RAAT topology, to say nothing of grouping endpoints into zones.
thanks Steve, I’m in Scotland so your right re language: using power cables in the house. and I’m guessing slim this is a part of the problem.
ho hum… so unless I completely redesign my system around roon, I’m going to leave off for now until I need to make changes.
I’ll revert to airplay to the Linn from iPhone iPad for my iTunes and allow Linn’s own app - Kazoo to control my tidal and my Flac library on the NAS.
was fun trying tho! and thanks for all your help.
Joe
@Joe_Lafferty, I’m going to give this one more try and then give it a rest.
I’m thinking that the problem isn’t between your NAS and your Mac, but between your Mac and the Linn.
Between your Mac and the Linn we need to insert one more device to take the place of Ethernet over Mains.
Use the WiFi on your Mac to send to an Allo DigiOne (Allo.com) device, with the new RPi B+ board, running RoonBridge. The new B+ board has WiFi built in. Then use the SPDIF output from the Allo to feed the Linn.
The WiFi signal should be able to reach from your upstairs Mac to the Allo DigiOne --> Linn and this way you won’t have to rearrange anything.
Personally I would run a long Ethernet cable to avoid the Ethernet over Powerline adaptor…if there is more than one then try to bypass both. A 20-30m cable should not be too expensive. Even a cat5e would be fine if you can’t get cat6…this is to prove it’s not the other more expensive kit like router, iMac nas and dac.
Sometimes there is no option for running cable but maybe maybe other things like a better Wifi setup is not out of the question
Ethernet is preferred, although I’ve had no problems using WiFi. Reading Joe’s post, it seems like Ethernet cabling isn’t an option, especially 20-30 meters, cheap it may be.
That’s why I suggested originally to move the iMac down to avoid the Ethernet powerline double hop…just to prove it’s the issue…not the other equipment
thanks for your replies. I’ve never used a raspberry pi machine, this looks like it could work… unfortunately, I just cancelled my roon trial… I’ll buy the kit and set it up and ask roon if they will let me have another trial to see if it works.
Not possible to run manual ethernet cable, I live in an old victorian flatted villa in the west end of Dundee in Scotland. My office is upstairs and a long way away from the living room with old lath and plaster walls so no easy route…