Tidal playlists in Roon fail to sync and playback issues (ref#BCE39J)

Support
1

What best describes your playback issue?

· Music stops playing unexpectedly

What type of Zone is affected by this problem?

· *All of my Zones* are affected.

Does the issue affect all file formats?

· The issue affects *multiple/all* file formats.

Does the issue happen with local library music, streaming service music, or both?

· *Both streaming and local* *library* music are affected.

Do you encounter any playback errors with the "System Output" Zone?

· The System Output has the same problem as my other Zone.

Is your RoonServer machine running MacOS 15 Sequoia or above?

· I still can't see my endpoints as available Zones.

Do you have a complex network setup?

· Both the device and RoonServer are connecting to a *single router*

Please try rebooting your router.

· No, I'm still having trouble

Do you have an approximate timestamp of when the issue last occurred?

· Every day.

What are the make and model of the affected audio device(s) and the connection type?

· Roon Nucleus.

Describe the issue

Tidal playlists in Roon don't sync with playlists on Tidal app. Playback keeps stopping or jumping tracks. Tracks I delete from playlists keep reappearing. Changing modes, eg playlists takes ages.

Describe your network setup

SkyQ, HP laptop, Naim speakers, Nucleus wired by Ethernet.

2

Hey @David_S,

Thanks for sharing for your report! Sorry to hear about your issues with Tidal playback.

Do you have any active VPNs or firwalls/third party antivirus software within your setup? Can you confirm Roon and Roon Server are listed as proper exceptions if any are active?

Putting your Tidal issues aside, from a recent diagnostic report we do see playback failures that are due to slow media - this likely isn’t due to your Tidal issues, but more so a unstable network connection. Here’s an example:

Warn: [Worker (11)] [Nucleus A + Hall + Kitchen + Mu-so + Uniti Atom] [zoneplayer/raat] Too many dropouts (>3s dropped out in the last 30s). Killing stream
Trace: [Worker (11)] [Nucleus A + Hall + Kitchen + Mu-so + Uniti Atom] [zoneplayer/raat] too many dropouts. stopping stream

How are you zones connected to your router / Nucleus? Are you able to test out a direct ethernet connection? I would also explore any options within your router settings to allocate network priority to your Nucleus and endpoints if at all possible.

We’ll be on standby for your reply, thank you! :raised_hands:

3

Hi Ben. I do have a duckduckgo VPN. I have just excluded Roon from the VPN. I also have Avast
antivirus and firewall, but I can’t see any way of excluding apps.

I have also just changed the network to 5GHz, to see if that makes any difference.

The zones are connected by TPLink to the network that the Nucleus is on, which is Ethernet-wired to the router. I can’t connect them directly to Ethernet due to location issues.

With Tidal in Roon, I logged out and then back in and forced a re-scan, which partially worked. but one playlist still has a 600-track deficit on Roon compared to on the Tidal app.

Another strange thing is that when I delete a track from the Roon Tidal playlists, it reappears before my very eyes! And often, the Improved tracks revert to the lesser quality.

Having said that, my Focal-Naim app streams perfectly. I am so fed up with these glitches in Roon that I am seriously thinking of going over to the Focal-Naim app alone. It’s too exhausting trying to get Roon to function consistently.

Thank you for your help.

4

Hey @David_S,

Thanks for the prompt follow-up! We have a ticket in with development for further investigation.

Have you made any changes to these playlists on the Tidal app directly, prior to the changes you’re attempting to make when in Roon?

And, just to rule out any potential network-related causes - please fully disable your VPN (the use of VPNs fall outside the scope of official Roon support) as well as your antivirus software - temporarily - and see if you can still reproduce the above issues.

If you can, please share the specific playlist name, and the attempted edits that have failed. We’ll pull another fresh diagnostic report and share it with development.

This issue aligns with the other issues you’re experiencing - there’s a miscommunication between Tidal and Roon and we’re hoping to eliminate any objects blocking this communication.

Let us know how it goes! :+1:

5

I did actually hypothesise that when I deleted tracks in the Roon Tidal playlists, they simply reinstated themselves from the actual Tidal app, so I now delete them first in the Tidal app.

Next time I use Roon, I will disable the VPN to see if this has any effect. I can’t find an option to disable Avast.

I just deleted Be My Boy (Re-recorded in Stereo) by the Paris Sisters from the Tidal playlist Pop 1 in Roon, and within seconds, it magically reappeared! I haven’t tried deleting it from the Tidal app as yet. And seconds later, it disappeared again.

Similarly, I found 2 versions of The Bells of St Mary, deleted one of them from the same playlist in Roon, and it came right back. It’s maddening!

6

Hi @David_S,

So to confirm, the track was eventually removed as intended?

This site may help in terms of adding Roon as an exception to Avast - note that you’ll want to add the following as exceptions:

Roon.exe
RoonServer.exe
RAATServer.exe

And here’s the link for Avast:

7

Hi @David_S,

I wanted to follow up and mention that our development team has also identified some areas of improvement with Tidal playlist syncing that should also help with your issue. Once a fix has been merged, it will be included in one of our upcoming updates! I’m not able to speak on specific timeline yet, but progress is moving smoothly.

You can keep up with specific software release notes here:

Thanks again! :+1:

8

Yes, Be My Boy has disappeared. The best way to do it is via the Tidal app and then re-scan.

Since I moved over to the 5GHz wi-fi, Roon seems to be performing better, but I will keep you posted if it starts playing up again.

Thanks.

9

HI Benjamin. Thanks for the update. Playback is still stopping frequently while playing via Roon. A reminder: Nucleus is connected by Ethernet to the router, while the Roon Server operates via Wi-fi from either my Windows laptop or my Galaxy phone or tablet. When streaming from Focal&Naim or via Tidal Connect, the stream is perfect. What could be causing this difference? Is it perhaps the Nucleus itself, and if so, would it be better to try making my laptop the core server? One clue might be that I always get the message that it’s taking longer than usual to connect to the Nucleus.

10

Hey @David_S,

Just a slight correction here - your Nucleus is your Roon Server :slightly_smiling_face: all other devices are running Roon, and are considered a remote device.

Based on your description, the issue doesn’t seem to be related specifically to your Nucleus. Swapping Roon Server machines could be a useful test, but we’ll ultimately want to pin-point the playback failures occurring with your Nucleus.

Since your endpoints ( your Focal and Naim devices) are running via Wifi, and you’re not able to test out a hardwire ethernet connection, can you test out bringing them closer to your router, and test if the same issues occur?

Unfortunately, we can’t compare the two - Roon is more sensitive to network conditions compared to other streaming services because of how it handles audio playback. Unlike apps like Apple Music or Tidal, which use buffering and adaptive compression to smooth out playback over less-than-perfect networks, Roon streams audio in real-time with bit-perfect fidelity and minimal buffering.

Do you see the same playback stoppages if you only play audio from the system output of your Windows machine or from the galaxy phone speakers?

Feel free to share a specific track name the next time playback stops, and we’ll enable Nucleus diagnostics for additional information. :+1:

11

The Naim Uniti Atom is about 2 feet away from the router.

The stream stops regardless of use of the laptop or Galaxy phone.

I will keep an eye out for a track that stops. But even Internet Radio is stopping quite frequently when streamed from Roon.

Thank you.

12

I was playing internet radio via Roon when it stopped at around 5.29am today. I moved over to Tidal Connect.

14

Please disregard the previous comment, which is now irrelevant. I tried to delete it, but for some reason, your system wouldn’t let me.

15

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