Volume level Roon Vs streaming

Greetings.

Just did a test. using SPL meter from Audio Tools in Iphone (Please dont laugt. i know its not kalibrated. akkurate and so on. But till it does measure Changes :smile:

Set volume at 50 on my Primare Pre60
Played a pink noise -12DB from Roon made 76.2dB on my Iphone.

Played the same pink noise using Primare as the streamer. that ended up with 82.9dB.
This is a major diff between them,

What can i do with Roon so i get the same level on them?

Im using Roon on a computer connected to my Pre60 by USB.

Hi Torstein,

I understand you are comparing two different zones connecting to the Primare. Firstly a USB connection and secondly a streaming network zone. Can you describe the streaming zone in more detail ? Is it AirPlay or RAAT ?

Firstly, check the Output Settings for each zone and try different combinations of Force Max Volume and Disable Volume and see if that makes a difference.

If the volume disparity continues then you can use the digital volume control in Roon to reduce the level of the streaming zone. Uncheck both Force Max and Disable Volume for the streaming zone and use the volume slider on the speaker icon at the right of the lower playback bar. This will mean the streaming zone output is not bit-perfect, because any digital volume control alters bits.

Hmm… no different zones. but 2 different ways of playing Music on my system.

volume level is set to 50 (max is 79)
1 is by Roon. 76.2dB
Roon is connected to my Primare Pre60 by USB. In Roon im using the ASIO Driver from Primare. here i cant change the volume level. (when i press the speaker in roon it says
Asio
The Volume is fixed.

I have checked everywhere (I Think) in my computer to see if there is anywhere i can raise the volume. but no. in drivers for the Asio its on 10 (Max)

2 the second way of playing mysic is from my Primare App on Ipad. 82.9dB
i just browse my files in my app (There is a Synology attacked to the network using minim UPNP server. This is where all my Music is (Alo the same Place Roon plays from)
so this way its the Primare watching the UPNP servers that are on my network.
My nas is setup using minim UPNP just because it doesent influence on the Music. no upsampling of downsampling. just plays the file as is. (there are heaps of other UPNP players that transcodes the files to MP3 or Wav (Synologys own UPNP server does that.

its really a huge differance in both volume and sound quality (Please dont get me wrong. it doesent sounds bad using Roon. )
The reason for me using Roon is the excperience using the Roon app. its just Amazing. Reading about artists. the use of TIDAL Hifi. i just love it.
But if i need to have a lover volume and sound quality. well then i need ot Think over again.

Hi Torstein,

The speaker icon says volume is fixed when either Disable Max Volume or Force Max Volume are selected in the ASIO USB zone Output Settings.

If Force Max Volume doesn’t match levels with another input to your amp then that other input is coming in at a higher level. There may be some way within the UPnP app to turn that volume down.

If Roon’s Signal Chain is showing lossless (purple light) and Force Max Volume is set, then that is the most that can be done in handing a bit-perfect stream to your inbuilt DAC. If other inputs using the same source material are louder then they are either being treated differently by the DAC (which Force Max should avoid) or being amplified before being sent to the DAC.

sorry Andy.

the only thing i got in my PrimareUSBAudio ASIO Driver (ASIO) Zone is the following.

Box where i can check “use Max Hardware Buffer Size” (This is not checked)
Max Sample rate PCM
disabled

Resync Delay
0ms

DSD Playback Strategy
Conver to PCM

then “Disable”.

Nothing about volume in here :frowning:

Hi Torstein,

Yes, my bad. I looked at an ASIO driver and see that it doesn’t have those controls. Sorry to mislead you. Those controls, however, don’t increase volume from Roon, they just tell the endpoint how to treat the signal. I’m not sure whether ASIO sends a volume signal or not.

In any case you will need to match levels by reducing the volume in the UPnP app. Once you’ve got the same levels then you can compare SQ.

:slight_smile:
sorry Andy.

to lover the volume in the UPNP Server is also not doable. there is no settings i can change the volume in the minim server.

if i lover the volume in the Primare APP. i will reduce the volume of my PreAmp. (wich is set to 50)
By doing tihs is like having a car race between two cars. and letting the Roon go on full Power while reducing Power on the Pr60 for letting the Roon keep up. (Thats cheating hahaha)
Im sorry but thats not a option. :smile:

If you want to compare equivalent levels between two unequal level inputs, the louder of which can’t be decreased and the softer can’t be increased, then I can’t see any way of doing it except by using the volume control on your preamp.

I would just put the spl meter down and listen to some music. :scream:

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That means there is sometihng happening between my computer and Preamp.
could be
windows
Asio driver
Roon
some settings in hardware in computer.

i really dont like things to happen without any explenation :smile:

ASIO drivers remove all control from thee native OS and sends the audio at full volume so that you must use hardware to control volume. This is to maintain the best audio signal out to the device. So not a function of Roon but your devices ASIO. You can use ASIO4ALL, not a true ASIO driver but rather an ASIO wrapper that does allow volume control in its control panel

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A review of the Primare spec online says that there is an optional 6dB gain available for different inputs, so something could be happening there.

I tend to think something is happening with the nas. I have discovered that when I stream from my WD Mycloud through their app to my Apple TV that feeds my Meridian F80, the bass gets distorted really easily. Using AirPlay from my iPad to the Apple TV has no issues though. Very frustrating!

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Good Points. ill check the 6dB and see if there is something there.

Please dont compare the WD nas with Synology. i got them both and its like comparing a Volvo widh a space shuttle. (Sorry WD)
It all depends on how you play the Music from the nas. UPNP or browsing directly to the nas.
(Primare can only use UPNP)

@Torstein_Kvamme did you ever get to the bottom of this?

No, I’m sorry but I haven’t dug into it anymore as I had some other issues regarding the analysis thing.