NAD/Bluesound Grouped Zones out of sync, stopping playing, and/or skipping tracks [Investigating]

Roon Core Machine

Mac mini, Apple M1 chip, 8 GB memory, macOS Ventura version 13.4

Networking Gear & Setup Details

Spectrum modem, Netgear Prosafe 8 Port Gigabit Switch, model GS108, ethernet connections

Connected Audio Devices

NAD M33, NAD CI 580, NAD CI 16-60, connected via ethernet

Number of Tracks in Library

8700 tracks

Description of Issue

System has been fine for over a year. Now, when playing iTunes library through Roon, everything is normal when using the one zone powered by the M33. When I add other zones, all powered by the CI 580/CI 16-60 combo, music is out of sync with M33, and zones powered by CI combo are out of sync with each other. Also, songs get started then pause and jump to the next song and that repeats. If the system makes it to the end of the song, it often stops playing before the next song starts. Roon also losing control of device. Same problems if I run the CI combo independent of the M33. All zones powered by CI 580/CI 16-60 are unusable at this point. I don’t have these problems when using the Bluesound app to play radio.

Roon Core Machine

Roon Rock on NUC i7 hard wired to ASUS RT-AX88U

Networking Gear & Setup Details

Connected Audio Devices

Running NAD M33 and Bluesound Powernode N330 in a group
Both hard wired to the ASUS router.

Number of Tracks in Library

26350 tracks.

Description of Issue

Since the most recent NAD M33 update the 2 devices in the group go out of sync after 1 track is played.

Do they play in synch through the native BlueOS app?

Roon Core Machine

Mac Mini M2, 16GB RAM
OS 13.4

Networking Gear & Setup Details

Deco XE75 Pro

Connected Audio Devices

Bluesound Pulse 300 ethernet CAT 6
Bluesound Flex 2i wireless
Bluesound Flex wireless
Bluesound Flex wireless
NAD M33 ethernet CAT 6
NAD C368 ethernet CAT 6
Bluesound Pulse mini wireless
Bluesound Pulse mini wireless

Number of Tracks in Library

47,264

Description of Issue

Sync is off in Roon since the most recent BluOS firmware, no issues using the BluOS app. Bluesound suggest this is a Roon issue.

Yep, been testing all day, only an issue grouped in roon.

Thanks, seems I’m not the only one which is kind of heartening…

I do find it a bit suspicious that blueos did a firmware update that lost roon if you did a factory reset, then did another update and then blame roon for lost synching.
Often the companies are talking at a level above front line support so probably best to wait and see.

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I discovered a clumsy workaround for the moment. If you start playing the group in Roon (which will lose sync) stop play in Roon then switch to BluOS controller and click the Roon Ready icon on the left and initiate play in BluOS the sync issue is gone. Switch to Roon and you’ll see that the progress bar in Roon indicates it’s playing and all DSP is working.

Something clearly amiss. I’ve posted on the Bluesound forum as well.

EDIT: Now it appears all I need to do is select Roon Ready in BluOS and then play in Roon and sync is fine.

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Yeah, the testing I did yesterday showed that using the BlueOS app and setting the group within that worked fine if using roon as the source.

Not a long term solution as I have an additional zone using a Raspberry Pi as the end point so not BlueOS compatible.

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I opened a support ticket with Bluesound regarding the out-of-sync issue. After some back-and-forth checking linkup id’s etc they claim the problem lies with Roon. I’m not convinced as the issue only arose after the last Bluesound firmware update.

2 Likes

Yes, I saw the thread and have also commented, suspicious that the error only exhibited when BlueOS was updated…

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Hi @Ryan_Caulfield,

Thank you for your undue demonstration of patience while we worked through the queue to reach your message. We’re admittedly quite behind but working diligently to catch up.

The symptoms you’ve described might be the result of a clock assignment issue or a network stability issue between the physical location of these Zones. Roon losing control of the audio device corroborates the second possibility. A few questions might help us pin down the problem here:

  • When you mention ethernet connections in your Setup Details, do you mean to say the NAD CI 16-60 is connected via the LAN/ethernet input, wired directly to either the primary router or the unmanaged switch?

  • Can you please provide screenshots of the Device Setup page in Roon → Settings → Audio for the group and individual Zones which are having issues? Is the Resync Delay set to a value greater than 3ms?

  • Do you have any DRM on this iTunes content? Another way of asking: if these are pre-Apple Music iTunes downloads (older than about 2009), there’s a chance some files are still protected, which might explain certain skipping. It’s certainly not underpinning your problem here.

Lastly, we’ve attempted to pull more precise RoonReady logging from your account, but it appears your Core is offline. When you have a chance, please open Roon for at least an hour so we can gain secure access to verbose logging from Roon’s communication with the affected endpoints during playback.

Thank you!

Hi @BCBC,

I am sorry for the slow reply. We’re working through threads with little or no attention and seeing what we can do.

Is this issue ongoing? We have regular comms with our partners and this would be an important thing to mention. Let us know and thanks.

Regards,
Wes

Thank you for the reply Wes. Yes the issue is ongoing with grouped endpoints. It occurred after the last Bluesound firmware update. It does not happen on in the BluOS Controller app.

If I keep both Roon and BluOS open I can start playback in Roon then stop playback, switch to BluOS and select Roon Ready and restart playback from BluOS which restores sync most of the time. Others on the Bluesound forum have commented on the same issue.

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This issue persists for me, too.

Connor, thanks for your reply. The Core is back online.

Yes, all devices are connected to an unmanaged switch (see photo). Connections to switch are: ethernet from wall, M33, CI 16-60, CI 580, iMAC, eero, TV. Photo of device set up page attached. All Resync Delays are set to zero. I do have purchased music from before 2009, but none are labeled as protected, only purchased AAC or matched AAC.

To describe the problem further, I can turn on Roon and run multiple zones for a few songs without syncing problems, but then the problems start, usually at the beginning of a song is when it goes out of sync. Then it may start jumping songs as previously described. There are no problems when only running the M33.



Hey @BCBC and @Psyclops,

Ben with the support team here, since some time has passed I wanted to check in and see if you both are still experiencing this issue?

If so, can you reproduce and share a timestamp of the issue? Thanks!

I’ll be on standby for your reply.

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I have this issue too. Do you just want us to report in this thread the date and time when the out-of-sync problem occurs or is there another way of submitting data?

Thanks Ben,

It appears to be ok, I had some feedback from BluOS as well and I think there was a further update.
The first day after there was occasional sync issues but none since.