Does Roon download entire track into RAM? [Memory Playback Discussion]

Hi Nick,

Playback from memory sounds better as mentioned by a few people on this thread. I’m not asking Roon to solve a problem with SQ, I’m asking them to explore further improving it.

Cheers,
Alan

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Hi Alan - my understanding is that playback from memory has the theoretical possibility of sounding better because it eliminates the potential noise of processing the FLAC decode and other electronic overhead, but that is only the case if the decode and other overhead is on the device that is also attached to the DAC.

Roon’s chosen architecture is different but has the same theoretical benefit: by decoding and processing on the core, then streaming to the endpoint, which should be doing nothing else, you get the same theoretical lack of electronic noise at the output point.

So while your suggestion to improve sound quality is well taken, if this is really important to you, you really should try out Roon’s suggested architectural configuration of separating the core from the endpoint/output.

Playback from memory represents a compromise from a user experience standpoint, in terms of loading up tracks and the delay that causes, etc. In theory Roon’s suggested configuration represents the best of both worlds. Just think of the audio streaming to the endpoint as being the same as the audio loaded into memory on a single machine.

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@BigAIMc No, I do get your point, but I put forward the theory that even if Roon was to load each complete song into memory before playing out, that would still not stop the fetching of data and CPU usage caused by the browsing of the Roon library, viewing artwork, lyrics, blogs, following hyper-links, browsing Tidal (the Roon experience) and I theorised that surely that would also degrade sound quality, if the fetching of sound file data in chunks rather than in one lump already causes sound degradation.

To my mind, the only way to get top quality sound from a streamer connected directly to a DAC using memory playback is to shut down the browsing experience and completely stop the I/O and processing of any data other than that from the sound file and ‘Serve the DAC’ directly from fixed memory, but this would kill the Roon experience.

A way around this is to send all library management and browsing off to a core machine located at the other end of an Ethernet cable, which is exactly what Roon does with RAAT and separate core/endpoints.

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Roon has specifically stated that they do not support Squeezelite and do not do any QA testing with it or any software based Sqeezebox endpoints. Roon running to my Squeezebox endpoints sound utterly fantastic.

I don’t know why I didn’t think to try this. Indeed it does work.

I can have the best of both worlds - the superior SQ of squeezelite compared to the Roon player component, and the library management and UX of Roon. I do notice some issues though:

  1. The Roon Device for the squeezelite instance allows a max sample rate of PCM 192. Is there any way to bump that up to PCM 384k.

  2. I do get the occasional glitch, where the playback will, abruptly in mid-song, skip to the next track. Perhaps it’s my version of squeezelite. I’m on 1.9.0.1.

What about the above as a short term solution @BigAIMc?

…but you can play music via Squeezelite end-point (my Daphile PC). External server address on Daphile settings -> Roon Core IP = success. Audio parameters same like LMS build-in support in Roon. BTW I have SB Touch with EDO mod and via USB-convert to SPDIF via M2Tech hiface2 SQ in Roon, works great, and this is really fantastic sound! Same story with Daphile end-point with supporting DAC (also M2Tech, HiFace DAC)… sounds great!

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No, you have max 192KHz/24 bit. LMS/Squeezelite all solutions based on this have limitation to 192. You of course can play DXD files but you have downsampling. Interesting thing - with Sqeezelite end-point (Daphile PC) some plug-ins give us more (for exapmple DSD support) but, in Roon, you have their implementation for LMS, and that’s all. Daphile PC works in “pure” mode, you couldn’t change advanced settings (when you put external server in settings, like Roon Core), and finally it works like another Squeezebox. I remember the same story with iOS devices before full support in Roon (as end-points). Before that, you use for example iPeng on iPad, and your iPad works in Roon like SB end-point.

It may indeed work and work well. However, Roon does not guarantee that it will work, they do not test/develop with it in mind and they don’t support it. Take a read of the Squeezebox Setup Roon FAQ page, the very last part discusses this.

https://kb.roonlabs.com/Squeezebox_Setup

How do I install Squeezebox on my ROCK NUC?

You can activate Squeezebox support in Roon as per the link in Rugby’s post above. Roon will then see any Squeezebox enabled devices on your network.

You cannot install any software other than Roon on a ROCK device.

I already activated the Squeezebox on Roon per that link.

I guess then my question would be how to enable Squeezebox on my DAC. It’s an Ayre QX-5 Twenty

I can’t see any mention of Squeezebox support in the QX 5 Manual. But it is Roon Ready.

I know. I use it with Roon RAAT. Just curious to try what Rajiv @austinpop tried

He was using something not supported officially by Roon, which is to get a computer and run a Squeezebox emulation program and then connect that to a DAC. You could get a Allo Digione and enable it’s Squeezebox software emulation and connect in via Coax.

Real Squeezeboxes are/were hardware. You can get them 2nd hand on eBay. However, given their popularity, they have held value for years. I have 3 different units still in use around the house.

I used to own a Squeezebox Touch a while ago. Great device for its time! I used to own one of their Logitech “boombox” radios as well.

I think I am going to get one of Innuos MK3 devices. Not sure whether the ZenMini or the Zen though. Everyone says they are significant upgrade to MK2

Hi Henry,

Nope, I’m afraid not as Austinpop confirmed off this thread that this only works if I override the OS on my Zenith SE with AudioLinux. I’m not nearly technical enough to contemplate doing this.

Also whilst I genuinely appreciate the responses here and understand that the community are attempting to offer helpful advice (mostly get an endpoint!) I’m a bit frustrated at the lack of a response from Roon representatives on the software request.

So one more time and updated to reflect Roons obsession with endpoints:

  1. Can Roon development team please explore cache memory playback on Roon player/server units with sufficient RAM resources to see if SQ is elevated as evidenced elsewhere?

  2. Can Roon development team do likewise and explore memory playback on endpoints with sufficient RAM resources?

@brian - even if it’s to say No, can you please acknowledge the request.

All - before anyone chimes in with the inevitable get an endpoint suggestion - FWIW I retired my endpoint (MicroRendu powered by LPS-1) because the Zenith was so good I no longer needed an endpoint to isolate against noise.

So it’s not so much a case of I am against endpoints per se. It’s more that this is fundamentally a software feature request. The LMS software implementation on the Zenith wipes the floor with Roon. This should concern the Roon team. I much prefer the Roon UX but I’m not going to suffer such a drop in SQ just for a nicer UI.

Team Roon. Do you accept the challenge?

Many Thanks,
Alan

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Have you addressed the above points in your plea?

No.

My request stands for Roon to explore this.

Well then you shouldn’t be surprised if your request is ignored.

At least run audiodiffmaker and capture the output streams using the both systems so that there’s (presumably) a demonstrable and tangible difference.

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