Hi MarcMarc,
Thanks to everyone who beat me to the bunch! Agree with all the above. One of the examples is the very download set that I purchased—Kubelik Schumann Symphonies. Pretty much all of the Deutsche Gramaphone recordings that they have on Qobuz in DSD are Tower Records Japan imports that you have to pay between $50-$100 on eBay to get in stereo SACD. They are not available on Amazon. Certainly once in a while you can find something used. I have a pretty good record store near me that has an audiophile Classical section with a lot of SACDs. They did not have that particular set but some of the other stuff from Tower Records they did like the Dvořák violin Concerto which was $50 per disc whereas on Qobuz You can download it in DSD for $10. I looked up the counting crows recording. I have the SACD of it that I bought when it was available for a good price of only about $30! It doesn’t even exist on Amazon and is not even currently available on eBay. Unscrupulous resellers are selling The mobile Fidelity CD version of it (non dsd) for nearly $400. Again you can download it for 10 bucks in DSD on Qobuz. certainly the selection is small and niche but hopefully it will grow as there are tons of DSD discs that have been put out on the market over the past 15 years. I get most of my current DSD recordings either from high definition tape transfers or native DSD. I always look to see if the actual SACD is still available as sometimes it is cheaper if it’s a recent recording like on channel classics and/or in multichannel. But a lot of these places are no longer even making SACDs. It was a format that unfortunately never really took off like it probably should have considering how good some of these recordings sound in DSD compared to the regular CD or non-high res PCM streams. Anyways DSD isnt for everyone but nice to see Qobuz at least offering some…hopefully they will keep adding them as the record labels are sitting on the files for no good reason.
Thanks
Doug
For SACD mastering, tracks are usually stored and edited in PCM (what they call DXD) and converted to DSD as the final mastering step.
First DSD purchases of my life. Decided to grab all of Norahs’s albums. Even through I have 2 of them already as a CD and hi-RES FLAC.
About 63 Euro for all 6 albums. A steal I did use JRiver for tagging. As they weren’t properly tagged.
DxD is basically PCM352 which ensures a minimum of crosscoding artifacts for both DSD64 > DxD as well as DxD > DSD64 conversion. Same with DSD128.
As a matter of fact there are several ways to record, mix, edit and master for DSD as a distribution format, may it be download files or SACD. Some transfers of analogue recordings are done in true DSD ADC while many of the classical record labels specializing in DSD and SACD simply do not care and record/mix in PCM96 or PCM48 which is not ideal for crosscoding to DSD.
That’s a bargain, I paid around £40 for just for the SACD of come away with me (2CH and 5.1)
I got 3 from NJ myself, and I am not saying I won’t go back for more if I enjoy them more than the CD/High resolution versions I already have.
I currently have about 40-50 DSD albums, partly from ripping SACD and some that I have bought as download’s and I think this will be a nice way to expand my collection.
Well they will likely be the only purchases for awhile. As most offerings seem to be of the classical genre. And that’s not something I listen to.
I saw some decent Jazz, which is apparently another Genre which goes well with DSD. I already bought A couple of DSD128 from Octave records in Jazz and classical and they sound pretty damn amazing. Now maybe the basic DSD 64 would sound equally as good.
Hopefully Qobuz expand their range over time
Nice, where did you buy these?
Look up to the earlier post’s and I posted a link to the Qobuz page
Thanks, I found them, DSD seems to be a bit hidden in the Qobuz store.
Also bought them all on DSD and a few albums I didn’t have yet in high-res.
Nice price with a sublime account.
Exactly, hard to find and easy to buy when you find them.
Every time I think about letting my Sublime subscriptions lapse they come out with some great offers.
Looks like I will sub again next month
I really like sublime as well, keeping it.
I ditched Tidal since they stopped with MQA, can find all I need on Qobuz.
Hoping Lenbrook/HRA comes out with an MQA streaming service and it gets integrated into Roon.
Annual sub here. I have 2 months to decide if I’ll stick with sublime or go back to studio.
I still have Tidal next to Qobuz as Qobuz misses some of the music I am listening to. But about 90% of the time when streaming, Qobuz is the one playing.
As you said, DXD has a Nyquist limit of 176.4 kHz, and since DSD64’s quantization noise starts raising well below that, you’d end up with a lot of noise when converting DSD64 to DXD. That noise will potentially affect any subsequent DSP. To avoid that, you’d have to low-pass well below the Nyquist limit (e.g. around 40 kHz), so you could easily do it with 88.2/96 kHz. And when converting back to DSD, quantization noise would clobber any ultrasonic content over 40 kHz, so again, 88.2/96 would easily do it.
I think the idea of DxD was exactly to have potential HF noise resulting from a DSD64 > DxD conversion far from the Nyquist frequency and potential quantization noise, alias and alike making it easier to first convert to PCM and than apply low-pass filters in the digital domain.
The problem is that the DSD quantization noise increases with frequency, so the farther you put the Nyquist limit, the more noise you get. And if you want to avoid avoid using a brick-wall filter and instead relax it, you’ll let in quite a bit of that noise.
Anyway, this is rather technical, and I don’t want to hijack this thread. We can continue in private if you’d like. Bottom line is that DxD is, in my opinion, is just as useful as the format it was supposed to serve.
That is accurate if strictly looking at the total level of noise. But in this case it was more about the spectrum of the noise and the fact that potential interference between noise and PCM quantization is far away not only from the audible band allowing you to use whatever low-pass filter you want to get rid of it.
For sure we do not want to hijack the thread, but I think it is important to discuss the fact that many downloads being offered as DSD are not necessarily native DSD recordings.
DxD uses at least 24 bits, so PCM quantization noise, even in the absence of shaping, is simply neglijible at -144 dB. At that bit depth, you don’t need oversampling.
The only way to have native DSD recordings is to not post-process at all. That’s probably only feasible with live recordings and analog transfers. I can’t see how that would be possible with studio pop/rock albums.
If you already have a HiRes version of Come Away with Me in PCM, be it the first one in (already upconverted) 24/192 or the later “remaster” in 24/96, you could have saved yourself the DSD version, since it was only converted from PCM anyway and should sound at least equivalent to the DSD version from a high-quality DAC with device-specific adapted filters, rather better.
I have therefore spared myself a pointless DSD 64 download.
The same applies to the other Norah Jones HiRes albums.
Even if the temptation is great in view of the prices for DSD downloads especially for Sublime subscribers compared to e.g. Native DSD, you have to find out with which technology the digital original was mastered or the analog master tapes were digitized with which format and resolution. In addition, some of the SACD versions from the period up to at least 2016 are simply up-samples of the CD versions, even on major labels.
As far as I know, Qobuz still has no real quality control of the music files supplied by the labels.