My take is that if a Composer is “credited” then he/she will have a Composition tab, if you check Bob Dylan that appears so , as with Mark Knopfler
There is no requirement for being Classical.
Neither of these examples exist in the Composer page , also there used to be a “show only classical” switch which I can no longer find
not a switch, a text link now to click on top.
But not what the others talk about they want albums so overview and discography instead of compositions and performances.
Spotted . it used to be a slider switch in the RHS dropdown
And the Yiruma example is odd, I couldn’t find a single same case in my library so far. For the record, this seems to me like an error. There shouldn’t be a person listed without a related work (shown). Or was he probably not listed at all on your composers page and you opened this page by other means or from other screens? I think Roon Labs has to look into such odd cases to figure out what is wrong. But it also shows what I meant above, that when switching to classical, information gets treated differently (composer credits seem to be preferred over performer credits) what, as I do believe, is not what people in general want but I think is implied by
Again and as admitted by Arindal and I agreed with I can see how some people might see a use for that in their library. What I can’t see is how such a change could possibly benefit all the others.
Well, this is certainly not an exception for me, and I suspect others… The trigger certainly seems to be classifying the composer in question as “classical”. I hope that someone from Roon Labs might chime in with some insight…
Personally I’d be happy if Roon could get the classical composers even close to right. I’ve discussed this here before, but over years Roon can’t get this right.
SS#1 &2- Composers(or artists) > Beethoven > Overview
SS#3- Compositions
SS#4- what is in the Roon library
@Geoff_Coupe please get the basic cataloging of classical composers right before working on other genres.
It is beyond ridiculous that when I search Beethoven in either ‘artist’ or ‘composer’ I get this list that is missing most of his symphonies. I could be wrong, but I’m pretty sure Ludwig composed Beethoven’s 9th symphony.
I know that, but I take nearly everything back. I still don’t see why I can’t have a “Composed by” in the Discography of a non-classical composer - if it’s about confusing users, well they don’t seem confused if it appears for Beethoven. And it could be collapsable or configurable.
But, back home I know see that the compositions are on Compositions anyway, including those not in my library, so I can live with that. (Though it would be nice if the empty space was filled with some info)
As mentioned I see several artists/composers for whom having an additional ´composed by´ section already applies. And it does not look like browsing would get harder or visibility has deteriorated anyhow.
Maybe my library structure and genre taste differ from yours but I have hundreds if not more than thousand of such artist-composers. I have just made John Lennon temporarily a classical composer and roon is showing 76 albums other than his own with versions of his songs:
Okay, potentially I could get a similar result in the album overview with focussing on John Lennon as a composer excluding his own albums. But somehow I like the quick overview on which albums his compositions have been used, similar to what I am used to the aforementioned non-classical composers.
I admit I like cover versions of well-known songs, I like film music, I like Jazz standards and musical/show tunes. Using the composition list is an option but for composers like the aforementioned it is not really giving an overview of cover versions existing.
The ´Composed by´ list usually comes last (or one but last in case of ´Compilations´ exist with this particular composer being solely performer) with the aforementioned non-classical composers, after Main Albums, appearances or ´with …´. I do not see it taking away space or making browsing complicated. The only things coming after that one requiring a bit more of scrolling are ´Similar artists´ or ´influences´ which I personally do not use.
and Nino Rota, Henry Mancini, Jacques Brel or Duke Ellington, I might want to add.
Can’t you for real? Others already posted examples for non-classical composers (but from the overview tab and not the discography), they are just very rare, and as I said before: AFAIK the categories and categorizing rules are the same for both tabs.
Am I wrong with that? Clearly the data sets are different and a user that is a composer only in a users library (overview) might be a performer too out there in the world (discography). Might this discrepancy between the person in a peoples library and the world be part of the confusion for Roon? Why Roon displays confusing results for some but not all composers in a users given library (composer is also performer but library only has credits for one of the two roles, discography has albums form both roles but can’t show the ones that don’t match the library role correctly)?
That seems not to be a problem of roon but rather of insufficient or incomplete metadata which roon is taking as a base to compile the composition list of a composer as well as his ´composed by´ section. My Ludwig van page looks healthy if I focus on his symphonies which are exactly 9 by number
In your case I see a lonely movement of Beethoven’s symphony No. 5 being misinterpreted as a composition on its own and no Opus number assigned. This might be originating from composition tags, track names or multi-part composition tags not following a standard which roon can recognize. So it is a problem of metadata, not of roon.
Maybe it would be worth investigating where this comes from. If it is a local file like in your case, it is possible to retag it manually or merge it with the correct composition which roon is calling (in exactly this spelling): ´Symphony No. 5 in C minor (“Fate”), Op.67´. If the source is Tidal (or less likely Qobuz), I do not know how to fix it.
No. In Howe Gelb, I have the following sections:
Each section that has more than 5 entries is collapsed by default. I really don’t see how a (default-collapsed) Composed By would hurt if added at the end.
So even less chance to hurt anyone. If someone has a lot of compositions that are recorded by other artists as well, they are probably a popular composer.
Don’t know. Clearly there are no compositions on Discography in the Howe Gelb case. I don’t know what the criteria are. I do think that sometimes Roon causes confusion because behavior follows some rules that are not obvious.
I guess one can argue that if someone is a performer and a composer (e.g., like Howe), then other people covering his songs are not really part of Howe’s discography. Fair enough. But then it would be nicer if the largely empty space on the Compositions tab were used somehow, e.g. for larger covers or some credits (e.g., it could say that a composition was recorded by artists A, B, and C on albums X, Y, Z. there is more than enough space for it)
And those/such albums don’t show for you if you revert that change? Because for me
So they are there but in different categories.
IIRC, did you showcase how it looks like when you change a non-classical to a classical composer because that is what you are looking for and would want to be your new preferred default. This means Composed by comes first as shown, no?
Very good idea. I would personally like to see a row of several covers of albums on which the particular composition has been recorded. Similar to the ´4-quarter=4covers´ icon in the playlist or general composition list:
The question is? Can’t you for real (get any composed-by entries in discography)?
An expected example for ‘no’ would be one where you have composed-by in overview but not in discography.
I don’t know if I could “get” them by messing around with the credits, but I spent a lot of time getting the credits right for Howe and for whatever reason (that I am not too keen to spend time on figuring out why exactly) the Discography doesn’t show compositions by him in a separate section, although he has composed hundreds of songs, many of which he performed himself solo and with various bands and many of which are also performed by others (and some only by others)
No, they all disappear after reverting the edit. Just tried it.
No these 76 albums under ´composed by´ do not appear in John Lennon´s overview page any longer.
In terms of actually having a ´composed by´ section, yes. I found it to be pretty useful both with classical composers and with those non-classical already having it (Henry Mancini, Duke Ellington and others).
No. It comes last after main albums etc. with all the aforementioned composers no matter if they have it by default or if I turn them into classical composers. That would be my preferred order and I do not see any disadvantage for anyone by that.
Fun fact: Using the Lennon example in my library, I get no albums at all, only compositions (and my composer Lennon also didn’t get a picture). So it might be that it actually has to do with discrepancies between a users library and Roon’s cloud DB, I expect Lennon is a performer and composer but the performer doesn’t exist in my library at all. So probably really a caused by a mismatch of roles (composer vs. performer) and data therefore held/prepared in an unavailable view.
Note: The discrepancy isn’t in the unchanged compositions view (always the same when available) but in the overview tab that is expected to be different between roles (classical composer, non-classical composer, performer).
You surely don’t have to mess around with credits, I wouldn’t do either. It’s just
I just seen that Geoff_Coupe already posted a picture showing composed by in discography:
So you can already have them if there is content that qualifies. I think for albums/tracks where a performer/composer also performed, we might never get a composed by entry though. For other cases … maybe my observation and speculation from above may help others to shed some (new) light on the matter.
Sure that this one is the legitimate roon main page of John Lennon? If you search for ´John Lennon´ it is the only result you get? Does it have bio and pic?
That was my initial question what exactly qualifies a non-clasiccal composer or his/her compositions to be listed under ´composed by´.
Correct, and that is intentional as you do not want to have duplicated albums on the same page.
