A message from the Roon founders

[Frederick_Davidson (Fred Davidson)]

@Duncan_Andison

I get the distinct impression that the support team are very stretched and this can result in a less than premium feel from a customer point of view. It’s not that each member of staff isn’t good enough… it’s a case of only being able to do so much with an ever increasing user base.

I agree.

An important byproduct of joining Harman is the potential for new staff through investment from the new parent company.

[adamus]

No horsetrailer?

[James_I (The truth is out there but not necessarily here)]

@gTunes

I think you’re minimizing the complexity of adding file browsing.

Danny at one point said that implementing folder browsing would be trivial. Not being a developer I have nothing to add to this part of the debate other than referencing what Danny said. I suppose it can be implemented in multiple ways, some simpler than others.

(I would have little need to use it, but I still think it needs to be in any product on a computer that uses files on a computer, period. It’s gotta be really frustrating to those whose libraries aren’t amenable to metadata organization alone. I didn’t get upset when ARC was released even though I wouldn’t use it, and I’m not going to get all upset if folder browsing is implemented even if I won’t really use it. Plus it will make boxed sets more accessible until Roon is able to address that issue specifically.)

Just in general, I am happy to see that Roon is at least now paying lip service (and hopefully more) to going back to GUI and server functionality and reliability. The product needs that TLC and the current release is a good start. And nice to see reversion on some of their missteps, whether forced by Harman or not.

[Suedkiez (Just a fellow user like you)]

@James_I

Danny at one point said that implementing folder browsing would be trivial.

Yes, implementing it would be trivial. Foreseeing all the ways it might end up limiting more advanced library management in the future is the difficult part and the other half of what Danny said IIRC. (Edit: not quite - my interpretation of the rather terse reasoning)

Edit: The post in question:

Folder Browsing [Never happening] 2016-03

ideological / philosophical – nothing technical. in fact, the technical problems are trivial. I address this in another thread: But the short of it is: this will never happen. There are 2 topics we are firm on not supporting: UPnP and file/folder browsing. For everything else, we are open-minded.

[Higinio_Martinez]

Hi Enno, thanks for sharing. If I can share my expectations, I would choose all Samsung smartphones to come with Roon and ARC apps, a trail-in period included, AND internal electronics allowing highres going out of the phone in all its glory (not resampling to 48k). On top, a nice internal DAC would be amazing. Crazy if the smartphone could include Chromecast audio and Roon could be compatible with it.
H.

[Charles_Peterson]

The apps are two clicks and one search away in the Play store - less clicks than it takes to navigate from the playbar in Roon back to the album view of what one is currently playing. Some may see this as yet more Samsung bloatware if included. Smartphone manufacturers are mostly focused on camera tech these days so I don’t see anyone paying a premium for better audio internals except for a few headphone enthusiasts. And remember, the phone is just a control point - without a server setup there’s no Roon to play. How many are going to do this because they happen to have an app come with the phone? I could be wrong though, and have been in the past.

[OffRode (new user)]

Roon’s CEO talks acquisitions, hi-fi enthusiasts and the “tyranny of choice”...

[Charles_Peterson]

I think Harman are on the right track redirecting Roon back to the audiophile enthusiast vs trying to target it as lifestyle product for all. Just too many barriers to entrance unless one is fully committed. I’m postulating that Harman may have seen too many resources dedicated to ARC for what turned out to be a small(ish) amount of users, and that it wasn’t bringing in new users as perhaps expected. Again, that need to set up a server is always going to be a stumbling block for the younger mobile crowd or the less than tech savvy.

[Chikolad (Lior)]

You guys ROCK!

[gTunes]

@James_I

It’s gotta be really frustrating to those whose libraries aren’t amenable to metadata organization alone.

This is a good point. I don’t have this problem but I understand that it’s a real and painful issue for some people. I’m not sure file/folder browsing is the only solution but it’s certainly a solution.

[gTunes]

@Suedkiez

Foreseeing all the ways it might end up limiting more advanced library management in the future is the difficult part and the other half of what Danny said IIRC.

The post you referenced is thought-provoking because of both its implications for the product and for how it illustrates that Roon, or at least Danny, has a deep commitment to a metadata-driven product.

“…never happen…” is a strong statement and one that is no longer true. This can’t be an easy moment for Roon.

[Suedkiez (Just a fellow user like you)]

It’s difficult, I know it too well as mentioned. Customers keep asking for something to work around some issue for which you have an idea what the right solution would be (e.g., perfect metadata in this case) but you can’t deliver it right now. The workaround, e.g., folder browsing, would help them right now. But you also know that after 10 years of applying manual workarounds, users will have tens of thousands of peculiar manual solutions, and every time you make large changes towards „the right way“ you risk breaking them.

Not an easy decision either way.

[Norman_Spector]

Can you tell me what offline listening means? I’m assuming that the Roon server and storage of files have to be on the same network

[Suedkiez (Just a fellow user like you)]

It means that Roon 2.0, until now, did not work if your internet connection was down, even though your LAN was just fine and all you wanted to listen to were your local files on your Nucleus, NAS, or similar.

[Norman_Spector]

Interesting; thanks. I’m finding that there’s less delay now clicking play and the track starting. Am i imagining things?

[Mike_LC (Mike)]

Thank you Roon Labs and to all the staff. From the beginning in 2019 Roon has provided me with what I wanted, easily accessible quality music playback for every room in my home and other spaces on our property. My only concern over the years was the loss of offline use but mine continued to work after that for the one 4 hour internet outage that did occur. Happy to know that is back in a supported capacity. Looking forward to what is to come our way.

Hoping to see my Denon receiver become Roon Ready, something that is apparently in the works.

[Suedkiez (Just a fellow user like you)]

@Norman_Spector

I’m finding that there’s less delay now clicking play and the track starting. Am i imagining things?

Some people commented on this 2 weeks ago, and I noticed as well although it was never slow for me:

Roon suddenly got a lot faster and more usable?

So my setup with about 200k Qobuz tracks struggled with speed for browsing and search which got a lot worse lately. I posted a couple of times regarding the issue, but I have noticed that in the past week or so things suddenly started to work very smoothly and fast. I have made no change to my network or setup, and AFAICT there hasn’t been a Roon software update. This makes me think there was an issue fixed on Roon servers or on Qobuz? Perhaps just more cloud capacity is added? Anyone else noti…

And maybe the new update has brought additional improvements, who knows

[Norman_Spector]

thanks for replying

[Carl]

@David_Burkholder

What is folder navigation?

It’s similar to a Windows file explorer or Mac’s finder but in this case integrated into Roon and specifically designed to browse your music collection via the underlying file structure.

[James_I (The truth is out there but not necessarily here)]

@Carl

It’s similar to a Windows file explorer or Mac’s finder but in this case integrated into Roon and specifically designed to browse your music collection via the underlying file structure.

Interesting. I guess there can be multiple ways to look at that.

All I was really thinking would be that Roon would have some button with a synonym for “open via file path” and then it would just open a window similar to how every other application opens a file (for which there is precedent in Roon since you have to use file path navigation for backups and storage locations). Then you navigate to a music file and it plays (or is added to queue, whatever). I suppose that could include a way to play a whole folder since that would be an album.

I agree there could be all kinds of enhancements. The file path would presumably be from the server not from a remote. Adding the ability to use the file path from a remote would mean the remote software would have to stream to the server and then back to the endpoint - that is where complexity comes in. But unneeded in my view - the point really is only about being able to find and play something without having to use the metadata route when it doesn’t find what you are looking for.