Couple of things:
1- The Nucleus’ USB output is electrically noisy:
There is no difference compared to a run of the mill NUC, Roon has not made any hardware changes here. Some DACs have very isolated USB inputs - Holo May for example, I don’t know about Denafrips.
2- My recommendation would be an OpticalRendu connected over USB to your Denafrips, and connected to the network over optical. Roon would play to the Rendu.
As an Electronics Engineer with 40 years of experience, I can tell you that simpler is ALWAYS better. I have a Gustard connected directly to my Nucleus and it performs superbly. Anyone who tells you that noise on a digital interface will adversely effect your DAC is wrong. A digital signal of any type is NOISE in the analog domain, a well designed DAC’s purpose in life is to convert the digital signal to analog while not allowing the digital signal to propagate. The NOISE inherent in the USB signaling is orders of magnitude above the insignificant noise that may be present from other sources in the USB signal.
I had better results with Nucleus to network switch (non audiophile) ethernet to DAC with an ethernet input.
It is interesting to me how quickly audiophiles dismiss the i2s input option if you have one. Many of the arguments several of you mentioned are theoretical, not based on any Sonic comparisons. I use my ears to tell me what sounds better, not theoretical arguments. I had a traditional USB setup—Sonore Sonic Transporter i5 server->Sonore OpticalRendu-> Audio-gd R7HE Mk ll DAC with both USB and i2s inputs. First I tried out the USB input and loved it. But after reading all the buzz about how good i2s sounds, I bought the Sonore UltraDigital USB to i2s Converter to see what all the buzz was about. My ears told me that the i2s setup was superior to the USB setup in every way that we “audiophiles” gauge the word ‘superior’. No theory—side by side comparison of the two options. I suppose, though I don’t know for sure, that many of you are unfamiliar with i2s, being the new kid on the block, and reject it in favor of the more familiar USB unofficial standard as the preferred way to connect to your DAC. And it’s very possible that not all i2s inputs will sound better than the USB input. But the gentleman asked how to get the best sound. I think it’s worth the experiment to try the i2s option. You might just prefer it.
That’s what a bona fide audiophile would say. Theoretically, in the absence of a blind test, it’s very possible you’re just biased, “after reading all the buzz about how good i2s sounds”.
Wouldn’t the same be true for you and all the rest of us? Aren’t we all biased toward our preferences? That doesn’t negate or necessarily inform what we hear with our ears. Anyway, I don’t want to stray too far from what the gentleman originally wanted. Try the i2s option—or don’t. Either way is fine.
Of course. That’s why Marian is suggesting methods to avoid the influence of biases.
It absolutely does have an influence. Scientific methods were invented precisely because after a very long time humankind realized that “I feel heavy objects should fall faster” doesn’t cut it.
To me I2s is definitely a better sounding format. I have a Musica Prisitina streamer to a Lampizator Golden Gate 2 that really benefits from having I2s. Beats out USB…at least in my system.
I2S is not a format, it’s a protocol for sending bits to the DAC. Same bits that would flow through USB.
I2s certainly is a format (developed by Philips) and transfers differently. Plus the general set up of the I2s cable tends to be better. I2s is the native language for DAC chips. And it transfers without needing translation. All positive advantages over USB.
I2S cables often have more solid grounds and better shielding than USB cables which can help both noise from groundloops and RFI… USB also has the downside of the signals being right next to the power and ground lines for a long distance which pollutes the USB power connection. Anyway…all that matters is what sounds better to me and to whomever listens to it in their system. In my set up, I2s (developed specifically for music) sounded better that USB (a UNIVERSAL data transfer cable.) If USB sounds better to you, then good for you.
All the best to you.
I don’t recall Marian suggesting any methods for anything, except to imply that my observations are biased and therefore not valid. And why are my biases any less valid than yours? You accept the fact that we all have them. Why not include your own biases which, according to the way I understand what you’re saying, are also invalid. This kind of logic is a bit ridiculous to me. Please, let’s get back to helping the gentleman figure out how to improve his sound.
AMEN!! Wise answer!
Blind testing is one method
All our observations are biased. Our senses are not perfect and our brains not objective. This is common knowledge.
Exactly
I do, and of course. Our subjective impressions are not necessarily invalid but they are, well, subjective.
Based on what we know, the logical approach is obviously to try and to remove our biases from the equation if our goal is objective knowledge.
I²S (Inter-IC Sound , pronounced “eye-squared-ess”), is an electrical serial bus interface standard used for connecting digital audio devices together. It is used to communicate PCM audio data between integrated circuits in an electronic device.
PCM is the format. I2S is the serial bus carrying it.
I²S - Wikipedia
It’s a serial bus specification, a large part of it being the protocol. Nowhere in the specs do they make any claims about sound.
It was not even designed to be used over cables. It was designed for on-board communication and hence doesn’t even have error detection.
all that matters to you
Source?
It’s quite amusing that the less one knows about, let’s say digital data transmission, the more confidence they have in explaining “how it really works” to people who do.
Dunning-Kruger effect is a scary thing.
In this case, it’s simpler: I don’t care how it works, I trust my ears. Let the eggheads scramble to explain what I hear.
Post-factual isn’t limited to politics these days.
Audiophile world has been post-factual for ages.
It’s not a format and was never designed to be used for any great distance or externally as it’s for data transfer on the circuit board between components and DAC chips. There is no standardisation of its use externally as different OEMs wire it differently. It’s just another way of them selling you another product with supposed better sq.