Bye Roon, why I am not renewing my subscription

(Fernando Pereira) #213

It’s hard to generalize. Some of us chose Roon so that they can have good-quality digital music distribution to multiple systems throughout their home, controlled by any mobile device that happens to be at hand (I tried several other options before, none good enough). Metadata integration is useful too, but not the key value for us. The recent upgrade of the Radio algorithm and integration with Qobuz are (delightful) icing on the cake. As for “a lot of money,” a Roon lifetime subscription cost a small fraction of the total hardware cost of my home audio systems.

(Moe Bernhardt) #214

It sounds as if you should take a look at 3beez Wax. I have been using it for years. It makes it possible to do everything you described. It uses Musicbrainz to populate as much metadata as possible – most of it, usually – and then I am free to add whatever I want, including track artists. It is especially good with classical and jazz, which happen to be the genres that predominate in my collection. You can also store liner notes with Wax and it has an embedded browser so that you can view Wikipedia entries related to the recording. Wax also has a powerful search capability. You might not like that it is available only through the purchase of a Wax Box music server. It’s a fairly expensive audio component, but it does everything that you need in a server and its sound quality is excellent. Also, I read that 3beez is working on a less expensive version. I still use Roon for casual listening, but Wax is much better for enjoying music in my own collection.

(Mr Fix It ) #215

I too have heard of 3beez wax, and it does supposedly have great classical and jazz support, but if you thought lifetime cost of roon was high you better sit down … maybe lay down before you hit the buy button on 3bw :money_mouth_face:

(Reader of the Internets) #216

Come on, it’s not that bad, is it? A Nucleus+ with lifetime Roon would be $3000, right? The Wax Box is $4900. Sure, high prices for what you get, but not ridiculous in the rarified air of audiophile gear.

(Chris ) #218

I also love Roon but use going to live music to find new music and would recommend this route to everyone.
Find the right live music scene for you and you get as much new music as you can handle with a great connection to the artists through meeting them if one chooses. I never use iTunes.

(Daniel Margoliash) #219

Hi Chris,
Just to clarify I meant I use iTunes to find something to play within the digital music collection I already own. Anything that maintains playlists the way you want could be equally effective. Once I find the {album | composition (piece) | song | movement | track} I play it in Roon. Somewhat clunky but Roon is dumb about letting me effectively use my best-in-class knowledge about how I want to organize my own music. With my playlists in iTunes I can find stuff much more easily. If I do not find a better solution I will investigate putting a unique marker at the end of each playlist name (e.g. @1, @2, …) and use that to search Roon, maybe even automatically.
For sure there is nothing like live music (although MQA and excellent headphones can be amazing) but it requires the time. I wish I would more frequently experience the nearby CSO and Chicago blues and jazz scene.

(Moe Bernhardt) #220

Thanks, Bill, for sparing me pointing out the obvious. In fact, you could also have pointed out that even comparing the price of the Nucleus+ with the lifetime Roon software subscription ($3000) to a WaxBox ($4900) is an apples to oranges comparison. The WaxBox includes 2 TB internal storage for music, 2 TB internal storage for automatic backups, an ODD for ripping my CDs, and a 128 GB SSD for a sound cache. The Nucleus+ has only an internal 64GB SSD for hosting the Roon Optimized Core Kit (ROCK) operating system and the Roon server software. And then there are the intangibles: 1) I get lifetime software updates and personal technical support (via remote desktop sharing) and 2) My system is future-proof. I’m not renting my metadata. It’s mine to curate and keep forever and I can export it to another platform.

(Mike) #221

Mmm, my sarcasm detector is red lining, but perhaps a $1900 difference is justifiable for a 2TB internal drive? And be honest, many interconnects cost more than a Roon lifetime. As for renting metadata, I don’t like renting anything either, which takes us back to the lifetime subscription model. Pay and forget.

(danny2) #222

I just use a tagger to edit the meta- tags themselves. That way the information is part of my files, and I’m not dependent on an outside source for information. Some of the tagging software allows you to download the info from one of the online sources such as musicbrainz, so you don’t have to manually write all the tags.
I agree, though, is info like the musicians playing on an album/track would appear when that info is available.

(Ged) #223

I initially read this as “I just use a teenager to edit the meta- tags” and thought - that’s a good solution.


That won’t work for classical. :stuck_out_tongue:

(Frank DeMello) #225

I can’t read my tags, use my ratings and the favorite function is very buggy in use and has never been fixed. Like a track, it highlights and disappears. Roon’s advice is it has favorited the track. Don’t worry. Instead of fixing it…And when it comes to sound quality it is severely lacking vs Squeezelite/iPeng which fortunately I can access with my Innuos server. No focus by Roon on improving/optimizing the sound quality.

After about 3 years I am regretting my lifetime sub. I wish they could be sold.


In about another year, you will break even on the lifetime, your pain will be over and you can stop complaining to any and all who will give you the attention.

(Chris ) #227

I spent the afternoon playing a musician friends new piece, the result of two years work, over Roon WAV 44/16 and it was fun to see the delight as everything he put into the music revealed its self. The layers, instrument separation details, it was all there.
This was with Meridian 218 and DSP SE speakers.

“Id love to have these as near field monitors” he professed.
Anyway, the point is, Roon over a network of Cat5e cables from a QNAP core delivered a sound that was way beyond his expectation. (Remembering he composed played and recorded it all)

So if Roon doesn’t sound good enough, people need to look elsewhere in their setup as there is nothing wrong with Roon’s ability deliver great sound.

(Frank DeMello) #228

For me it’s about what “may” be a bad investment. Not about breaking even at 5 years (because I wouldn’t have stayed 5 years based on where we are today)

You are the worst type of user Slim. On a crusade to protect the product (for no compensation I know of) while you accept whatever Roon gives you and shout down anyone with another viewpint. This will drive zero innovation.

Roon has such promise. Will it be fully realized?


Not on a crusade and who’s shouting?

I’m just tired of all the impotent whining that seems to have become rampant in this thread and others.

split this topic #230

14 posts were merged into an existing topic: Does Roon download entire track into RAM? [Memory Playback Discussion]


But there is better (IMO) sounding software out there and this is an area that I believe Roon needs to look at. I am coming up to 4 years as a Roon user and whilst I think it is the best all round player/library currently available I think it is looking a bit tired/dated and in need of a serious overhaul.

(Mike) #232

Lots of software companies have moved (are moving) to a subscription model, its the trendy thing to do. $99 per year to use MS Office, $120 per year to use Photoshop, $120 per year to use Roon. Its not about “bad investments”, its about do you want to use it or not. As with any service, if you don’t want it, you stop paying and move on. No need to be all dramatic about it.

(Chris ) #233

No, If I have the composer and creator of the music listening to his music on my system via Roon and he tells me that the music sounds better than it did in his studio when he made it, wishing he had my speaker system as his monitors, then Roon cannot be getting in the way of audio quality, it has to be something else…

I could go into details as to his comments on accuracy etc, but they were all good. He is a fussy bugger too…

Any sonic improvements Roon may be able to make must also be so minor as to be very low down in the order of things.