Devialet RAAT zone convolution grouping delay issue

Using convolution filters with a 500ms delay on zoneA.

With Allo digitalone as zoneA, I set the group delay to -500ms on zoneA, which means group playback with zone B is in perfect sync.

With the Devialet RAAT as zoneA, this same setting does not work, and zoneB plays out of sync.

I was doing it that initial way as I sometimes group other zones and it saves tweaking all zones, especially if I disable convolution altogether and it needs resetting to zero. Workaround is using a 500ms delay on all grouped zones but it’s gets messy. Having the -500 on zoneA is the only way to guarantee everything stays in sync regardless of what’s grouped.

Not sure if this is by design or a bug or a change.

The ideal would be the convolution filter DSP have a value for delay so it could be set per filter, which could be ‘set and forget’.

Hello @hifi_swlon,

Thank you for your request. I have brought up this issue with the team and they have noted that delay in convolution is different for each sample rate, while we would like to improve further here, the behavior you mentioned is not currently possible.

We’re going to take a look to see what can be done but I can’t comment on a timeframe of when we will be able to address this specific issue. Thanks again for the feedback.

– Noris

Regarding this ´issué of the delay being dependant of the frequency, two workarounds:

  • force resampling in Roon to a single frequency on the Devialet - delay will be constant
  • alternatively turn off resampling, and apply a Null Dirac convolution filter of the same length on the second Raat zone

Nothing to do with sample rates…

All my filters have been aligned and fit into 500ms at all sample rates. I predominantly use redbook anyway.

The issue is quite simple: the same settings that work (and have done for a year) via an Allo digiOne RAAT into Devialet, don’t work via the recently released RoonReady Devialet direct. And that is a -500ms group delay on the zone running convolution. The same value in the group delay box on both devices gives different results, notably the RoonReady Devialet isn’t in sync. My hunch is the group delay field isn’t being applied (or incorrectly applied) on the RoonReady Devialet.

As mentioned in post 1, the best place for this value would be within the convolution filter setting, but that’s not possible.

Not sure why this got rushed over to a feature request?

IIdeally, Roon would compute the filter delay (a basic autocorelation/max signal algorithm would do it I guess) and compensate for the delay automatically in grouped mode.

Yes, that would be ideal. I’ve suggested that in the past but to be 100% honest I don’t bother much any more as there’s way too much noise on here these days.

But the workaround I had here was valid, it’s just not working the same way on two RAAT devices, so something’s wrong somewhere.

Oh well, seemingly bugs are being turned into feature requests these days… that’s a sad thing to see. The Devialet RoonReady is buggy anyway, so I’ve gone back to the Allo digiOne, which continues to work as expected.

Hello @hifi_swlon,

Before I address the convolution grouping delay issue you are seeing, I would extend our apologies for the difficulties you are seeing in getting your Devialet Roon Ready system up and running as you would have expected. We have spent many hours working with Devialet both in the certification process as well as post-release striving to make this integration as seamless and reliable as possible, your experience has obviously not meet expectations so far which is disappointing to hear.

In regards to the Convolution delay compensation, I think you may have stumbled onto a bug that we were previously unaware of. More testing needs to be done in the area by the QA team, but I can say with confidence that this is not limited to the Devialet Roon Ready implementation. I will be sure to keep you updated on the status of the issue, testing is scheduled for the upcoming week.


@john following a private discussion with @Christian_DEPLANTE : when you fix this issue, is it possible to take the convolution filter delay (potentially quite long for very advanced filters in the bass region) into consideration in the display of the cursor in the playing progress bar, and lyrics sync? As of today, it seems to be in advance with the actual sound as the processing delay is not considered.

Ideally, Christian would like to have this compensation of delay being possible with HQPlayer as endpoint, some filters like closed formed Mega can be 3-4 seconds long. It doesn’t seem that HQPlayer is sending back this information to Roon for display delay : play bar and lyrics.

Yes, the delay should be accounted for, both in the dynamics cursor, and in the Lyrics panel, in all cases in Roon (with or without associates software like HQplayer). If there is no simple way to automatize this delay, there should be a place where the user can experimentally adjust it for his setting.
Such delays will also need addressing when streaming audio with video, the lip sync becoming crucial.
Thanks for studying this guys !

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