DLNA/UPnP support would be really nice [Not on the roadmap]

I know that Roon likes the RAAT approach and it has a lot to commend it. Howvever, I really like the Roon interface and would wholeheartedly embrace it if only it support UPNP. Prior to Roon I was using jRiver and it can see all the music playing devices on our network (quite a lot, Linn, Naim, Marantz. LG, Pioneer . . . ). I can play music to any of them. However, although the jRiver interface is pretty good, especially jRemote, the Roon one is streets ahead and integrates Tidal too. I would definitely pay just for that and completely ignore RAAT.

I would suspect I am not alone in this.

2 Likes

Maybe not alone, but, UPNP is pretty much opposite of everything Roon is trying to achieve. For a more technical breakdown of why UPNP is not the greatest see…

3 Likes

The problem as I see it is that most existing “low cost” systems that exist (and many allready have installed in seporate sones in the home) is based around upnp/openhome. And so, in my case I have to use another system (upnp control / airplay devices (wich can not be placed in a sone…)) for playing music during parties etc, even though I would prefer using the roon-interface. ROON Groups only work if I have a bunch of PC`s that I would rather not have placed around my home alongside low cost solutions like f.inst sonos. IMO not having support for UPNP/openhome solutions at some level is “shooting yourself in the foot” as far as end user usability (wich in turn means your customers will look elsewhere).

Edit: I have one main system where audio Q is the priority. But I also have small solutions around the house for background music. It`s these rooms that have upnp capable devises in them allready. Yes UPNP is not ideal (neither is windows imo), but for everyday and party use… there are many users that would be shown your great software if you supported it.

I am trying to find a backway by using some software in addition to your Bridge software on my DIY NAS, but time will tell.

1 Like

You make a good point Gunnar about existing installations, but since 1.2 Roon Groups are not restricted to PCs. There are currently a number of inexpensive endpoints (ARM devices, Android devices) that can be grouped together as RAAT groups. See Anders’ post in this related thread.. If Brian can get Chromecast Audio working as a RAAT device then that would be something else …

I would also become VERY interested in Roon if it could be UPnP/DLNA/OpenHome capable.
As stated above I also believe that Roon is ignoring the largest part of the market today.
I prefer a minimalist approach. In my case fewer high quality products are better than a bunch of extras tagged on to existing equipment.
I have two streaming DACs that use the UPnP/DLNA/OpenHome standards and their manufacturers are not planning to release Roon Ready versions or firmware updates at this time. They do not see enough market demand for what they consider a niche market.
If Roon supported UPnP/DLNA/OpenHome standards they could get people involved in their music management system which could lead to greater pressure from the buying public on the manufacturers for the full treatment.
This is a business case to improve market share by embracing what the market needs.
Just my thoughts since I would like to see this functionality in the Roon product.

4 Likes

I can’t see Roon supporting DLNA anytime soon, but I can see small footprint low cost devices running Roon Bridge and outputting to legacy devices, enabling people to use their existing gear and upgrade as kit becomes Roon Ready. Thats already here.

Why are you calling them legacy devices. Pretty much all A/V equipment is being released now supporting DLNA. No major manufacturer is supporting Roon which is pretty unknown for most people.

Fundamentally I think Roon have the best user interface for playing music. Personally don’t care about all the RAAT stuff, I just want easy access to playing music anywhere in my home. I am happy to pay just for that.

CJ

3 Likes

I pretty much agree with Richard on this.
Everybody uses UPnP/DLNA and many are using OpenHome while very few use RAAT.
I do not want to discuss RAAT as a superior technology since I pretty much agree with that idea already. That is not the discussion here.

I think we are talking about supporting the vast majority of the market to get more exposure which can increase market share which will influence manufacturers.

Roon RAAT can become the system of choice based on user acceptance and ease of use or it can become the Sony Betamax of the modern era, excellent technology but little acceptance.

I have three very good quality streaming DACs in my house that use UPnP/DLNA/OpenHome over my gigabit Ethernet.
I would like to improve the music management (server) and play selection (controller) side of things without adding devices.

4 Likes

Hi all,
I have seen in older post other threads where Roon management was not too kind to the UPnP/DLNA devices out in the real world. From reading those posts it seemed like Roon would never even consider add UPnP/DLNA to their system.

Well that was then and this is now so I am curious to know:

Does anyone know how to or been able to connect a UPnP/DLNA streamer to a Roon network player for playback? Or is this not possible without the participation of Roon?

Does Roon have any plans or ideas about how we older device (meaning UPnP/DLNA streamers) users can actually use the Roon system short of telling our device manufactures to implement Roon or buy a new device?

It seems like a very large untapped market that can be addressed or ignored.

Any ideas?

That would be oversimplifying things: DLNA is an inherently flawed protocol – there is currently no way to implement it while maintaining the Roon quality standards we know and love. See the recent (3/16) comments by @brian in this thread:

While I do appreciate the convenience supporting DLNA in one way or another would offer to owners of DLNA devices, this seems to be a case of skating where the puck is going to be – instead of where it was years ago.

2 Likes

I would add to @RBM that the modern technology is so extremely inexpensive, there is little need to try to preserve value in existing hardware. For example, many devices combine a DLNA streaming endpoint with a DAC and that DAC also supports digital inputs directly; in that case, a SonicOrbiter for $300 can sit in front of it and solve the problem. Or if that doesn’t work, a SonicOrbiter plus an AudioQuest Dragonfly DAC for $400…

I went through that decision last year: I had spent a relative fortune on Meridian Sooloos gear, and when Roon came the storage and server and user interface became obsolete. Ok, I had gotten the full value I wanted out of those systems over the years. Replaced them with cheaper and better Roon parts. I still use the Meridian endpoints, they work fine with Roon, but when technology advances I will happily replace them with new gear, they provided good service for many years, but the world moves on.

That would be oversimplifying things: DLNA is an inherently flawed protocol – there is currently no way to implement it while maintaining the Roon quality standards we know and love. See the recent (3/16) comments by @brian in this thread:

While I do appreciate the convenience supporting DLNA in one way or another would offer to owners of DLNA devices, this seems to be a case of skating where the puck is going to be – instead of where it was years ago.

1 Like

I will try to make a software solution to be installed on my NAS then. From a buisness point of view this makes no sense to me.

Most of my friends have sonos systems (wich support dlna) and that is afaik what most people are using here in Norway. I find the interface flawed, so does many of my friends that have these systems, and after showing them ROON they were impressed and are all possible customers. BUT, not if they have to change out the sonos hardware. A upnp - roon bridge should imo be at the top of the priority list for roon, as this would make it possible for all users of existing systems to test ROON without having to change hardware. Seriously…

Quite a few of these people are hifi-men wich have grown up and priorities have changed. They still want good sound, and many like me may have downgraded the main system a bit (or just stopped upgrading it) and added more everyday music playback solutions like sonos in rooms around the house. The main system would benefit from RAAT and I use a Cubox-I with ROON-bridge in mine, and that would be an acceptable upgrade for most that has a seporate “hifi” system I think. But changing out the entire multiroom system for RPI`s etc… seriously?

Edit:

"Audio outputs

    Roon streams to all the audio gear you have, and makes it all play nice together"
4 Likes

was running anyway out of disk space, just ordered a QNAP TVS-671 i5 8GB
NAS to be ROON-safe for the future

I promise to purchase ROON lifetime as soon as ROON offers native support for my LINN KDSM/1

1 Like

as stated in another thread, it’s not up to Roon, it’s up to Linn.

I already read all the corresponding posts, both at LINN forum as well as at ROON forum, and I have posted my wish for native support of LINN DS by ROON also in both forums

just to summarize where we are:
o LINN so far was not able to provide a control point with adequate UX (user experience) therefore LINN should have an interest to connect ROON and LINN DS directly
o ROON charges 120 $ / year resp. 500 $ for lifetime which is a lot of money, all the MP3 guys are not willing to pay this amount of money just for a front for their music collection, on the other hand every owner of a LINN DS is a potential customer of ROON

therefore from a business point of view both LINN and ROON should have a significant interest to hook their systems together without any compromise in sound quality and by this way combine outstanding sound with outstanding UX

I don’t care how things work technically (whether ROON supports OpenHome or UPNP or implements Songcast or whether LINN supports RAAT), I just want you both companies to sit together and implement what is missing by many many LINN DS owners

just imagine RONN and LINN would work together:
o every LINN dealer will be happy to demonstate the LINN DS music system with a ROON front end, by this way increase LINN DS and ROON sales
o both ROON and LINN could announce their cooperation on their web sites and inlcude this news in their newsletters
o LINN could include a redeem code with every new sold LINN DS
o last not least: all the LINN and ROON forum members will inform themselves anyway …

therefore I really don’t understand why so many people are writing and discussing about this topic already for such a long period! ROON and LINN, PLEASE sit together and just do it! :slight_smile: PLEASE stop pinpointing to the other party (LINN: it is up to ROON to implement Songcast and the other way around ROON: it is up to LINN to implement RAAT)! Include both business development people as well as technical people … GO FOR IT!

btw: will post the same text on the LINN forum …

1 Like

I’ve just tried Roon, and it’s beautiful.
However, as it doesn’t support DLNA, it’s useless with my NAIM streamer.
So good-bye…

1 Like

Naim is releasing Roon Ready support in the Uniti line very shortly. They demo’d it at CEDIA 2 weeks ago, and the firmware update will be released soon.

Unsure if you have a Uniti product or something older.

1 Like

Don’t be so hasty. Even if you have an older Naim streamer it can take a Roon feed from optical/coax from a raspberry Pi endpoint.

…Even if you have an older Naim streamer it can take a Roon feed from optical/coax from a raspberry Pi endpoint.

But you can say goodbye to DSD64 too. You need to buy another box, get good interconnect & a good PS too… all this is not a convenience solution IMHO…Naim never implement AirPlay in classic series, so honestly I don’t see a great future for the old series for a Roon integration support. Only new series and future streamer beneficent of Roon integration, for old series it will take a miracle to have it. Pray my brother…pray for it.