Jeff,
If you think that the Unfolding - Rendering process means upsampling then I do really encourage you to read about MQA Technology.
It’s foundation is absolutely different.
And far more interesting and exciting.
There’s one thing you can’t deny MQA, their marketing is well worded and very clever.
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Aha. Now I see what this is all about.
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Hi all,
I’ve had to moderate some posts … please stay on topic and discuss the topic not each other.
Please also take account that non-native english speakers may inadvertently use a turn of phase that rubs … let’s try to see beyond that and move the discussion forwards not backwards.
If this topic devolves into yet another polarized MQA debate … the MQA posts will be stripped out.
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You need to read up on the Sabre ESS9038. If you use one of the 7 the preset “oversampling FIR filters” or the 8th customizable oversampling FIR filter, the DAC chip will oversample the input as much as 8x (up to 1.536MHz).
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Yes, I know that the filters are disabled for MQA.
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Of course I have heard a full MQA DAC. My PS Audio DirectStream DAC with Bridge II card is such a DAC. I was completely unimpressed with MQA.
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We’ve been talking about MQA so the filters are all disabled. In any case from the Sabre literature they can be bypassed at will.
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Then there’s no reason to mention the filters.
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If you do not like MQA, that´s fine, since it is a matter of personal taste [Moderated]
Enjoy your listening and thank’s for commenting.
Well actually there is: as the MQA upsampling filter coefficients would need to be programmed into the Sabre DAC for any Sabre based DAC that doesn’t have a FPGA filter implementation prior.
Actually, no, we have not been talking exclusively MQA. Also, MQA is a small subset of the tracks available to listen to out in the real world. Most people have some local library tracks and there really aren’t any MQA tracks in that local library. I use Qobuz so I don’t to worry about MQA tracks at all.
The DAC you have does not allow you the option to bypass the built in oversampling FIR filters. You must pick one. Yes, if you use MQA you don’t use the filters. But, I bet you don’t listen to just MQA on Tidal, do you?
[Moderated] Also, I never said that MQA upsamples. I said it was not lossless. But several articles in Stereophile mention the MQA “upsampling renderer”. I wonder what that does?
Why did you come on here asking questions when you have made it quite clear that you think you are the expert here?
That’s not correct, MQA was introduced later in this discussion … the topic as it was created is about Roon’s signal path … Lossless vs. Enhanced… so it is quite understandable why people are discussing non-MQA sources.
I recommend you embrace the topics origins rather than sparing with other contributors.
Let’s move the discussion forwards … but be prepared that others will have different and sometimes opposing views.
Is food better without salt ?
Sometimes yes, sometimes no. That is why salt shakers exist.
DSP, whether room convolution, upsampling with apodizing filters in Roon or HQ Player or software MQA decoding, can be used for the purpose of higher fidelity reproduction of the original music by correcting room response, shifting noise or avoiding unnecessary processing and consequent noise in a DAC. Just as salt can be used to shift the balance of flavours back to some notional ideal after cooking.
Assigning qualitative terms like “better” or “worse” to DSP as a whole is an overgeneralisation.
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So let’s go back to the original discussion: Lossless vs Enhanced for Roon signal path.
It’s been bugging me since I don’t have an MQA capable DAC for now to test myself: If Roon sends a bit perfect MQA track signal to a MQA fully capable DAC (MQA Core decoding is checked off), and the said DAC does full unfolding and rendering on hardware, will Roon signal path say Lossless or Enhanced?
Honest question.
I am not sure your question makes any sense. If the track is a non-MQA track, an MQA DAC will do no unfolding or rendering. How could it. The signal path with either be lossless or enhanced based on what would be if any other DAC were on the receiving end.
Never mind. Bad wording on my part. I edited it
I can’t check either, but I’m going to guess Lossless, because my understanding is that the signal path describes what happens in Roon, not what happens in the DAC.
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This thread says otherwise:
Yep, looks like I’m wrong (lucky I changed “bet” to “guess” 
)
The signal path description appears to change according to the MQA capability of the DAC.
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Ehm… Gene, I’m not quite sure why you addressed your exposé to me.
Not that I don’t agree with most of whatever you say by the way because I do.
Just one thing: I used to respect Hans Beekhuyzen, until I started noticing a lot of similarities between some of his reviews and the marketing drivel about the products he was reviewing.