On the LMS forums some years ago, someone exhaustively Audiodiffmaker’d FLAC vs. WAV vs. Wireless vs. Wired and every time got a null result.
Audiodiffmaker’s null point is around -90dB down which is so many more orders of magnitude more sensitive than the human ear to be not even close.
Unpacking FLAC is such a trivial exercise as to never be mentioned again. Remember for instance than Squeezebox was doing this on device 14 years ago with CPUs of such low computational power that you’d probably find them in smart kettles these days.
It is a total non-issue.
4 Likes
James_I
(The truth is out there but not necessarily here)
1420
But not too short to spend time typing the same thing repeatedly into this thread.
I am NOT back in this thread, as it long ago ceased to offer any new information or logically useful argument. I was just lurking to see if anything new has been said. No.
But this quote just goes to show that effectively Chris is trolling everyone else here. He’s not going to back his position up with anything approaching data, or fact, or even bothering to do a quasi-scientific listening comparison that would still count as listening to music.
Instead, just continue to repeat that he likes how his system sounds.
Chris, we all like how our system sounds. You don’t need to say that every 5 posts.
Thanks for the insults, I have as much right to be here and re state my position as you have. I can enjoy music and browse the forum/web as I go easily enough. In fact I enjoy doing so. Believe it or not, I also enjoy joining in on the debate. So, less of the insults, I hope we all enjoy music in the end.
Perhaps everyone could stop saying things like “There’s nothing new in the thread”; “I’m leaving the thread”; I’m not posting in the thread anyomore", only to pop back and add something inane to that effect.
You’re all doing it. Can you not see the hypocrisy? You either post in the thread, or you don’t.
Channel Mr. Pacino and stop flouncing.
James_I
(The truth is out there but not necessarily here)
1424
Hi Chris - this was not intended as an insult, as in calling someone dumb, or anything like that. And yes of course you have the right to post here.
But if you are going to just repeat the same statement over and over, that MQA sounds better than anything else on your system, and that really is all you say, it is not much to ask whether you’ve actually compared the same master across formats.
Then you say “life is too short” like you don’t have time to even put any mild scientific rigor behind your statements. You’ve asked others who post anti-MQA positions whether they’ve actually listened to it. I think it’s fair for the same to be asked of you on the other side.
That is why I feel it’s a form of trolling. It’s intended to generate further argument without pushing forward in any substantive way.
I just call it like I see it. 2 years ago when I first used Roon I think one of your posts was the first I ever read. I don’t think the forum would be the same without your contributions. I do not want to insult you. But if your main argument is that MQA sounds better, then it is simply not too much to ask whether you’ve even done any casual comparisons of the same master across formats.
Chris is just saying that in his opinion MQA sounds good in his system, and he enjoys it. That’s all he has to or needs to say.
And to be honest, by focusing on how MQA sounds, his posts carry a hell of a lot more credibility than the quasi-scientific mumbo-jumbo being posted by others on the thread.
Good one Chris! Enjoy!
I disagree completely. It is in effect the very definition of trolling if you aren’t advancing the debate in any way with new information or providing some kind of rebuttal to a genuine point.
Of course I have listened to CD and MQA Versions, I find MQA just better and the more listen, the better if feels to me. Smoother, clearer details etc.
I know I have said this many times, and then I am told of a hole in the sound stage and distortion that I just do not experience. These ideas, amaongs others, are put across as fact, and they are not… they are opinions and if know one challenges this, they become facts by default.
In Internet slang, a troll is a person who starts quarrels or upsets people on the Internet to distract and sow discord by posting inflammatory and digressive,[1]extraneous, or off-topic messages in an online community (such as a newsgroup, forum, chat room, or blog) with the intent of provoking readers into displaying emotional responses[2] and normalizing tangential discussion,[3] whether for the troll’s amusement or a specific gain.
James_I
(The truth is out there but not necessarily here)
1430
Sorry Martin, I don’t agree that it’s more credible to refuse to do any comparison.
I do believe Chris has every right to post and did not intend to imply he didn’t.
But he ASKS others whether they have listened to MQA or just hate it on principle alone. I think it is fair to ask the same back, and the response that life is too short to even do a quick comparison - no one said double blind, wire your system for A/B or anything like that – is simply as non-substantive as those who rage against MQA for the purpose of just raging. In effect, I think Chris is better than that, and can do better than that if he wants to do more than troll.
Finally, I agree that MQA can sound great. It can also sound just louder at times. It’s case by case. If Chris really wanted to push forward substantively with his position, he’d be comparing Yes-Fragile, same master, across formats, and explaining why MQA sounds better to him. Otherwise, what does it really mean?
I have, the same one. Over and over. Adding nothing constructive to the debate.
It’s fine to state your position. It’s fine to restate your position.
It might be fine to re-state it again, and again, and again, but you have to add something, some nuance to the debate otherwise what’s the point?
He’s made 194 posts (and counting) in this thread alone. Nearly double the next nearest poster. And the majority of them are the same thing regurgitated. If needs be I can quote text him.
2 Likes
James_I
(The truth is out there but not necessarily here)
1434
I would never say you’re not entitled to that opinion. You were directly asked whether you’d compared same title, same master, across formats, and your response was that, if I may paraphrase, that takes too much time.
If you want others to be intellectually honest with themselves about MQA (i.e. listen to it, see if it actually sounds good) then I think it is fair to ask the same of you - if you have done so, then I can check back out here as that was my only objection to your statement. When you said “life’s too short” I took it as in effect that you won’t back up a subjective opinion with even a subjective comparison.
To be clear, I appreciate your posts and a lively forum is what keeps me coming back. You are clearly a passionate music fan and in that respect we have far more in common than anything that could be in conflict. That one statement set me off though as being unwilling to consider others’ points of view when you have otherwise been advocating for exactly that.
I guess you do agree that MQA do sound a bit like SACD (DSD)? That ‘analog’ and overall ‘harmonics’ seems to prevail. In my opinion, they do sound pretty close.
I have no problems with other points of view, each to their own. But it is just not practically possible to get the Master copy to do the kind of comparisons you describe unless this is a full time occupation and have access, time and money. (Many reviewers have been gifted these for review purposes on a ‘Burn after reading’ basis)
Life really is too short from my point of view… How could you even know you had the Master Copy anyway? Assuming one does though, then we have to look at individual systems, rooms etc. This will be different for everyone too. Music can be effected by ones age, mood, health, time of day etc, so with this in mind, what is valid?
So from a practical standpoint I have to trust people I consider credible and then go with my perceptions in my system.
I trust the likes of Bob Ludwig, Bob Stuart, the guys from 2L, Hans Beekhuyzen to name a few. Back in the day I would look at the credits for Bob Ludwig on a CD as part of my decision to buy it. I had noticed they always sounded good to me, it was like a mark of quality.
From my perspective, there is no need for me to re invent the wheel, I can just enjoy the music in the knowledge that great care has been taken in its production and delivery.
The main topic here is titled MQA Disappointing… Well, I don’t think so.
