Privacy policy clarification

With Roon 2.0, playback without internet access is no longer possible. The reason given was that the local search engine was replaced by a cloud-based solution.

A cloud-based solution for browsing my local music library will hardly work if the relevant data is not also stored in the cloud.

If this is actually the case, then it is a clear violation of the privacy policy " Information about your music collection is used to provide you with rich metadata, and is stored in Roon’s database on your computer or Roon Core appliance. This information is processed and cross-referenced on Roon’s servers, but isn’t stored there."

Our feature request to enable playback of local music w/o internet access was dismissed and closed.

I can imagine that the roon team is disappointed because of the amount of feedback on the topic, some of which was harshly worded. But it takes two to tango. Communication could be better on both sides. Deleting messages, closing and rejecting votes, not providing the necessary information and clear communication in preparation for the release… yes, everything could and should have gone better!

I’m expecting an official statement from Roon detailing exactly what data is stored in the cloud and how the search interacts with my local music library.

2 Likes

This requires a precise answer from Roon.

Roon’s statements about the new kill switch in 2.0 preventing local playback when the internet goes out do imply that your database remains on your server locally, complying with Roon’s legal agreement with its users.

If the database is sitting there then basic local search of album, artist, track name is trivial. Roon could quite easily function offline with a limited search capacity. It could also function offline just pulling up the list of albums or artists or genres from the locally stored database. iTunes, JRiver, and other music playback apps have done this forever.

Deleting the database from the local server and moving it to the cloud would explain why the kill switch was instituted in 2.0. Not even displaying a list of albums would work if the data has been deleted locally.

No changes are needed to the privacy policy at this point as no new personal data is stored in the cloud. If we were to do that, we would update the privacy policy.

No. That was one example of what changes would come, but the work was not completed yet. However, when that happens, we would not need to have your library contents in the cloud to make this work.

We are not disappointed. It was expected that a tiny minority would be extremely vocal, and what we’ve seen is far fewer complaints than we had planned for. Overall, this whole release has been far less dramatic than we were expecting. We actually were expecting more people to run into this problem on day 1, but it looks like almost no one actually ran into it.

Deleting is only done if a person violates the forum policies. Usually, posts are moved around to keep things orderly and to discourage soapboxing. We’ve also created a #feedback area at the top-level and moved many of the types of posts you are talking about there, so they are in 1 place. Votes are not rejected or closed out. Voting topics are closed to prevent pile-ons and soapboxing, but actual voting should still be allowed. The voting was a feature added so we could receive interest without the commentary. The new #feedback area is for the commentary.

No one is building a cloud-based solution for browsing your local music library. You are just making stuff up now.

The next step will be to have the cloud services do an intelligent merge of results using the knowledge in Valance. None of this will change anything about how personal data is stored.

4 Likes

No such kill switch was announced or implemented. Pull your ethernet cable and try it out.

We would never dream of doing such a thing. There is no benefit to that strategy.

I’m using Roon 1.8 because Roon has stated that 2.0 will not function if you “pull your ethernet cable.”

It is Roon that has stated that there is a kill switch in 2.0 that stops local playback when the internet is unavailable. That’s not my invention.

Find me that statement so I can fix it. Anyone can easily prove you wrong though: just, pull the network while playing. It won’t stop. You will most likely be able to play more as well. If we had a kill switch or the database was in the cloud, we wouldn’t be able to do that.

What I’ve said was very precise: Roon 2.0 requires internet connectivity to operate properly.

1 Like

Using the forum search function to find your categorical statements about the kill switch, here is one from the discussion thread that was moved recently (the most popular thread on the forum):

“You must have internet access to run the Roon Core 2.0.”

This and other statements from Roon do not say “properly.”

I get it—a user (maybe more than one) did pull the ethernet cable and found that playback didn’t stop instantly. It was unpredictable in his case. So, it’s not an instant kill switch: it’s a quick but unpredictable death switch. But death is death.

I think I and hundreds of other users are simply seeking the courtesy and respect from Roon to provide a slow and predictable death when the internet goes down. Or, better yet, just put Roon on life support so very basic playback continues using a minimal bit of info from the locally stored database and music files.

If internet is not working then killing off search using Roon’s servers is fine, obviously. I respect the challenges and hard work in building an excellent search capacity on the server side.

But if the database and associated music files are sitting there on my server then killing off all music playback is not fine. I have a database of album names, track names, artists, and genres sitting there on my Roon ROCK NUC (or wherever). Every type of music playback software that I’ve ever used (JRiver, iTunes, Audirvana, etc.) can search a local database of basic info and supports queueing the results playback.

If, as you have told us in this forum, the local search has been deactivated, then it is exactly as I wrote it down here.

What does that have to do with personal data and the privacy policy?

… and is stored in Roon’s database on your computer or Roon Core appliance. This information is processed and cross-referenced on Roon’s servers, but isn’t stored there. …

Just read it.

@Charles_Dunlap, you have been vocal in the other feedback topics about this, and that’s fine. But here you are off-topic, as your desire and requests have nothing to do with the privacy policy.

I suggest you stick to that other topic.