User Experience- Avold WTF Moments

Feedback Feature Suggestions
1

So, after installing ROON, how many of us have had the WTF moment when our selection ends and ROON keeps playing? And why are ROON developers still forcing that WTF moment on new users? Is it some sort of private joke? Or are the developers so gosh darn proud of the “Radio” feature that can’t keep from forcing ALL new uses to recognize the radio feature exists, by defaulting it to ON as opposed to how it should be, OFF!?

Here’s a tip, learning about features is why the manual should be read. One shouldn’t need to read the manual or post here for instructions on how to turn off irritating features; especially ones that kick-in when one doesn’t have a clue what’s going on, or doesn’t prefer software to have autonomous control.

Developers: You won’t piss off a new user by defaulting the Radio to OFF. But you may do so by leaving it as is – defaulted to on. Why then is it so important to default the Radio to on?

I love ROON and am on my second year of use, but these sorts of quirks are head scratchers when they needn’t be.

2

Actually, it makes more sense to have the Radio on by default rather than off. Why? Because most people use the Radio. So let people that won’t use the Radio turn it off. It’s not like it is hard to figure out or deal with either way. It’s very clear in the Queue screen.

4 Likes
3

Maybe most people use it. Maybe not. No one knows except perhaps the Roon team.

But I would appreciate a nag asking me if I want it the first time I play any zone. (I mean, for example, when you add a new device it’s also on by default. One can’t kill it forever on install.)

6 Likes
4

The whole point is Roon evolves based on suggestions like this. If you come across an issue/idea, be part of the solution to make Roon better.
On the other hand, it’s hardly rocket science to work out what is going on.

5

The whole point is Roon evolves based on suggestions like this. If you come across an issue/idea, be part of the solution to make Roon better.
On the other hand, it’s hardly rocket science to work out what is going on.

My purpose for posting was just as you suggested in your first sentence.

Regarding your “hardly rocket science” statement. I agree once known, it’s not rocket science. In fact, once known, nothing including rocket science, is rocket science. That’s why this sort of issue needs to be viewed with neophyte eyes, not experienced ones.

So, we’re obviously in agreement that the Radio On isn’t rocket science. However, still there are posts here about the very thing that isn’t rocket science! What is the benefit of forcing a new user to expend their time to research or post about something we agree isn’t rocket science? How many newbies are startled and confused by the Radio? Why, because someone assumes the radio function is used more than it isn’t!? Even if this is a fact, rather than an anecdotal assumption, that’s still not a reason to keep it as a default.

Along with performing maintenance and adding new features, I would think that the ROON Team would be concerned with securing new clients. As I mentioned, defaulting software to perform something totally unexpected, is not a good introduction to ROON. It provides frustration for zero, nada, zilch benefit. Why frustrate a new user or any user for that matter with a default that shouldn’t be?

A satisfactory fix for ALL may be to provide not only an on/off Radio toggle (defaulted to OFF), but provide a 3rd. option to force the Radio to be on, no matter zone changes or anything else, until its again turned off. Wouldn’t that simultaneously satisfy Radio users and non-users alike; but more importantly, not irritate new users with a: “huh, what’s happening” moment, when unselected tracks begin playing? A “rocket science” level of knowledge is unneeded to conclude that any level of pissing-off potential customers is unacceptable.

Radio use vs non-use may be a variable that can be measured, I don’t know. But it’s impossible to measure the frustration level experienced by new users due to these sorts of (non-rocket science; read the manual) decisions.

Will, or does the Radio On frustration rise to the level of preventing a purchase, who knows, but why take that chance? What could possibly be the benefit of defaulting the Radio to on, compared to adding a level of frustration; with the potential result being the loss of a new ROON customer?

6

By this logic, every toggle option in Roon should be set to off/no and only set to on/yes explicitly by the user AFTER they have had to search for that feature. That would be ridiculous. But hey, suggest away…

7

You made a very good point in your first post but the expression ‘Pissed Off’ to me seemed very disproportionate in this context.
It’s only music and this is a friendly forum on the whole. The ROON team do listen and take these things on board and things evolve. Here is the news, Roon isn’t perfect, but one day it will be a lot more perfect than it is now and with your help too.
Rocket Science, once understood, is still rocket science though lol. Good one…

I have to admit some of the MQA topics seem tonal you aggressive to me though.

2 Likes
8

Chris, point well taken, “pissed off” was a little too aggressive. I didn’t mean it personally or as harshly as it could obviously be interpreted. Unable to convey facial and vocal inflections via writing oftentimes causes misinterpretations on both sides of the conversation.

What I was attempting to infer is that the little frustrations oftentimes accumulate, adding up to much bigger ones especially when dealing with new learning and items such as software.

If I wasn’t so smitten with ROON, I wouldn’t be so passionate about suggesting changes and bringing new users on board. It’s debatable whether this fairly banal issue will help one way or the other in that respect. But whenever I see something that seems to add frustration to new users for no apparent benefit, I simply wonder why not change it and prevent new downloaders from the same frustration I felt a year ago and I know many others have also experienced. Editorial over and out…

2 Likes
9

No problems, I think Radio Off as a default is a great idea but I don’t make these decisions. I do like your passion though. Personaly I can’t fathom why more people don’t ‘Get’ Music at all, let alone Roon.
Cheers, Chris :wink:

10

I personally never use the radio function, precisely because I do have a radio (a real one)and because the few times I have used it (by accident) I was not impressed.

I completely agree that the default should be off.
The fez times I have setup a new endpoint it has always caught me by surprise, and I always struggle a little to remember where the setting is.

11

I agree with Mrmb. As a new Roon user I find the radio feature a big plus. (I’ve been using Pandora for years, though I have my issues with it.) I read a review of Roon by someone who said he found all sorts of new artists using Radio based on playing a single track. However, even though I’d read about this, I was surprised the first time I heard a track I hadn’t selected start playing, and it took me a while to figure out how to get to the Radio toggle switch for when I only wanted to listen to one album.

Maybe it would be helpful to have an introductory “walk-through” video explaining some of the most commonly used features? I know, everyone would have a different list of “commonly used features,” but I think Radio would make it on most lists.

I also would like to know if there’s a feature similar to Pandora’s “thumbs up” or “thumbs down” on Radio. If not, I think there should be. Yesterday when Radio was playing, a track came on that I absolutely hated. I’d like to be able to tell Roon “Please don’t do that again!”

1 Like
12

I think radio should be off by default.

My reasoning is the following scenario: When you first set up a new endpoint and play some nice original CD rip with lower levels and walk away, you then have to go running back when Radio picks some brick wall remastered stuff to play after in radio mode.

When turning radio on I usually turn on sound levelling as well.

13

You can get Radio to never select a track by Banning it. Go to the track, click the heart twice. The first click will fill in the heart as a favorite, the next will turn it into a circle with a line through, aka Banned Icon.

14

The force that I hate the most is that shuffle stays on until one actually turns it back off. A real PITA if you forget.

1 Like
15

@Rugby Thanks, but I don’t think I expressed myself clearly. From what I’ve read, clicking “Ban” will prevent the track from ever playing again in Roon. So if I don’t absolutely hate the track, but just find it jarring to suddenly hear something by Cream when I’m listening to Irish fiddle tunes, then banning isn’t the answer.

More to the point, it’s clear from a number of interesting threads like this that the Radio feature is very much a work in progress. I can live with that.

16

Hi, I am new to Roon and have been using it for about 2 weeks now. While I am growing to love all the music discovery features it can be disorienting at first. Once you do the research you have these “oh now it makes sense” moments. In addition to radio, which has been discussed at length already I also made the mistake of importing recommended Tidal genres. Holy smokes, hundreds of albums suddenly appeared based upon songs in my library and genre selections. It took two days to clear out the artists I didn’t want. I am also still not sure what all the track symbology really mean. I thought the CD icon meant it is a local copy but that is not entirely the case as I have ripped songs that don’t have the CD icon. MQA identification is still an issue and I am not always sure I am playing the highest res version of a song available before actually playing and inspecting it.

Having said all that, the value I have found in the Roon/Tidal combination is discovering new music and it’s much easier to let it flow and not try to micro manage the system and just enjoy the music!

Alan

17

Just to be clear, banning will prevent Roon from choosing it in Radio. You can always purposefully play the track.

If Radio pops up something I don’t want to hear, I just hit the Next button.

18

If it ever happens again, here’s how to clear out the hundreds of unwanted TIDAL albums in a couple of minutes.

19

Thanks @Geoff_Coupe. I did find this page after clearing them out one by one became too tedious.

Alan