Where does one begin?

Roon Software Discussion
1

I posted an initial query about a month ago and never received any reply or response of any kind. If one is unfamiliar with Roon and wants to learn more, including trying to decide whether to purchase, where should one start?

Thanks,
Geoff

2

The Knowledge Base is a good place. Once you feel like you’re oriented and have an idea of how you want to set up your Roon system initially, just download the trial, and then any questions will manifest themselves naturally from that point.

(If you read a lot on this forum, it’s easy to get the impression that most people have trouble with their Roon installation, butI think many/most ussers set things up without too much trouble.)

3

The Roon knowledge base is the place to read and the bulk of your questions should be answered. If any questions remain come back and we will try to flag someone with answers if it is possible.

https://kb.roonlabs.com

4

Thanks. I have looked at the Knowledge Base and what I have found there is not enough to get me to begin a trial membership.

I tried to explain in my post that received no reply, what my current set-up is and what changes I anticipate making soon. My reason for doing so was that I do not want to waste my free trial period if I don’t yet have the basic requirements to make Room work well. Or if the setup I anticipate having soon, will be a better one for making the trial period as useful as possible.

So where could I pose a more detailed question about my system, where I might get some feedback that would be helpful?

Thanks again.

5

Maybe you could just link to your previous post? Was it under your current username, because if it was, I can’t find it.

(Seems like I used to know someone named Geoff Mirelowitz, many, many years ago. You didn’t grow up in Central New York by any chance?)

6

Thanks David. I cannot find it either so perhaps that is the problem. I was so new to this site that I didn’t even get my initial comment posted correctly! (Although I did get a two “discobot Greetings.” in response.)

Assuming this was all my mistake – or lack of competence – where should I try to pose my questions again?

As for your question, I did live in Syracuse, NY as a child from 3rd grade through 5th. (We are talking the early '60s.) My father was the last and only person in his family to retain the full family last name. So to my knowledge I am the only person with my name in existence. It is a small world isn’t it?

7

You might as well just restate your situation and concerns right here in this thread, and then one of the moderators can move the thread if they think there’s a better place for it.

And on the other topic, it appears we went to Charles Andrews Elementary School together for a couple of years. Pretty crazy.

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I just checked your post history @Geoff_Mirelowitz. Unless you created a second account, we have no record of your first post. Maybe it didn’t post properly. That would explain the lack of comments!

That’s a common question, and best answered on this community site. You will find varied setups ranging from frugal to luxuriously expensive, from Do-It-Yourself to Turn-Key, all sounding spectacular at the price range.

If there’s anything people here like to talk about, it’s the setups that we all have, so please do repeat your situation :slight_smile:

9

Yes, I definitely went to Charles Andrews! We lived on Hardwood Avenue in Syracuse – 50+ years ago!

Here is a brief rundown of my system, that I would be integrating Roon into:

In the living room where my two channel stereo system resides I use a very old Mac G4 (with an OS that cannot be updated beyond 10.5.8 – ancient Snow Leopard) strictly as a music server. An external Firewire drive holds about a Terabyte of music that I play from the Mac through a USB connection to a Be Canto DAC 2.5 to a MacIntosh integrated amp and a pair of Sonus Faber Concerto speakers.

When I stream Tidal on this system, I do it from an iPad directly to the Bel Canto and into the stereo because the OS on my old Mac won’t support Tidal. (This requires an Apple Camera connection to USB.)

I have been waiting for a very long time for production of the Geek Source which is a music server that has been crowd-funded by LH Labs. When – and if – it is ever produced, that will replace my Mac G4 in that system. I am told the Geek Source will either be Roon ready or will be updatable to Roon ready via firmware in the not too distant future.

In our TV room we have a home theatre set-up that revolves around a Marantz SR7400 receiver (about 15 years old) and 5 Paradigm speakers (of the same vintage). But the digital end of that system is better because in that room I have a brand new iMac (running Sierra 10.12.5) with a USB hard drive that has the same Terabyte (or so) of Music. That system takes the music signal via USB from the iMac into an LH Labs Geek Pulse DAC (which is NOT yet Room ready) and via RCA cables into the Marantz. When I stream Tidal on this system I use either the Tidal desktop application on the iMac (which allows me to play MQA files) or Amarra 4 Luxe.

So…the question is can Room be integrated into either or both of these systems and, if so, how?

Many thanks to anyone who can help.

PS: Danny Dulai thanks for your post. No, there is no second account (that I am aware of) so I guess the original problem was my own mistake.

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As far as I can tell, in this system, you should be able to install Roon on the Mac and have everything work. Roon-ready is not an issue for the DAC, it just takes the USB signal and plays it. I have a Geek Pulse and it works fine. (Here is an example of the tweaking you see discussed here: you have to decide if you want volume control to be from the knob on the Geek or from Roon’s user interface. It will come up in one mode, I forget which, but fully functional.)

11

The obvious questions remaining all have to do with your network situation: Ethernet? WiFi? What sort of networking hardware do you use, and how are things arranged?

For starters, though, you could definitely run Roon core on your iMac to see if you like the basic concept and UI/UX. As Anders notes, your Geek Pulse will work fine.

It’s not at all likely that any Roon software will run on the G4:

https://kb.roonlabs.com/FAQ:_What_are_the_minimum_requirements%3F#Supported_Platforms_for_Roon_Core_or_Roon_Remote.

Also…

https://kb.roonlabs.com/RoonBridge

I’ll see what I can find out about the Geek Source.

12

I’ll assume that the two Macs are on a network and can access one another. If so, you’d install the version of Roon that manages the library on the new Mac, you’d install the Roon end-point software on the older Mac, and you’d install the Roon controller app on the iPad. Roon server scans your music locations to build the library, you log into Tidal via Roon so as to have access to all of that music, and you set up the devices you want to control the music from to tell them what devices and what outputs you want to control.

I often use the machine my library is maintained on, in my office, to control output in the office directly. I use my laptop to control output of a NUC that is connected to my main stereo in the living room.

I have no experience with Macs, so I don’t know about compatibility on your older unit.

13

I took a look at the Indiegogo page for the Geek Source. It’s not clear to me specifically what Larry & crew have in mind for Roon compatibility, but it seems like the Source could potentially be a high-quality RoonReady endpoint. It seems unlikely that it could run Roon core.

14

Thanks again everyone. Here is some additional information that may be relevant to the questions that are being asked. (Apologies for my own low level of knowledge of these issues.)

We do have a Wi-Fi network in our home. There is an ethernet connection between the iMac I mentioned above, an Apple Airport Base device, and the router we rent from Comcast.

The old Mac G4 is on that network but has no ethernet connection.

The old Mac is so old I can’t imagine that Room would work well with it. So it is not clear to me if installing Roon on my iMac would be sufficient to allow me to use Roon in both rooms.

The whole wireless connectivity issue is confusing to me. At one time I understood that Hi-Res Files (above 16/44kHz) could not be played wirelessly. In other words a 24/96 file on my iMac could not be played wirelessly on the system in the living room (the one with the old Mac). Or, as another example, if I play Tidal through my iMac’s desktop can I somehow make the MQA files play – at their higher resolution – in the other room on the system with the old Mac?

Finally I do not understand the difference between A RoonReady “endpoint” and a Room “core.”

Yes the Geek Source – if it ever gets produced – should work well with Roon. Emphasis on “if.” This is one reason I am reluctant to “burn” my free Room trial period now. Because I may need a trial period again, once i get the Source. (If I get the Source.)

15

The G4’s out of the picture, I’m afraid. To have music in both your rooms (without moving the iMac) you’d need a Roon endpoint in the living room. This is where the network comes in. Ideally, you’d have Ethernet cable running between the two rooms, along with an unmanaged switch or switches in the mix. However, with the right WiFi network, it should be do-able via WiFi. What specific model is your AirPort Base station, and what’s your WiFi signal like in the living room?

Have a look at this KB article:

What are referred to as “outputs” in the article are essentially what I’m calling “endpoints.” Given your current hardware, I think you want a RoonReady device that has Ethernet and/or WiFi in and USB out (in your case to the Bel Canto DAC). Note that Ethernet in could be by means of a WiFi router (maybe an AirPort Express in your case), a WiFi access point with an RJ45 jack, or a mesh router.

There are a lot of these kinds of endpoints available, ranging from quite inexpensive (e.g., Raspberry Pi, Cubox-i) to mid-priced (e.g., the Sonore Sonicorbiter SE) to relatively expensive (e.g., the Sonore microRendu and ultraRendu). (The cheapest endpoints tend to involve more DIY effort to set up.)

16

David, I will read the article and hope to understand this better. Meanwhile…

“What specific model is your AirPort Base station…” I don’t know. It’s one of those big cubes. (My grasp of the technical terminology is not too impressive is it?) It is not marked with a model number of any kind.

“and what’s your WiFi signal like in the living room?” Good enough that when I stream Tidal through my iPad in that room I rarely if ever get any dropouts and the sound quality (through the Bel Canto) is quite good.

If I understand you right (big if) the Room Core would be on my iMac. So if I had the Source, I would have the right equipment for a Room Endpoint in the other room. But the true arrival date of the Source is known only to LH Labs.

I guess I could buy an Airport Express to use until the Source arrives. Assuming I could figure out how to hook everything up to make it work. Running an ethernet wire from the room with the iMac to the room with the stereo won’t work.

Someone at MQA offered his individual opinion that I could try something called EoP to solve the wireless issue? But I know nothing about EoP…

17

It seems like the network situation is okay, at least for purposes of getting started. I wanted to clarify that the Airport Express or other WiFi access point would be in addition to your network endpoint. Oversimplifying, what the access point is doing is giving you a place to plug an Ethernet cable into your WiFi network in the living room. This provides a means of connecting a network endpoint that either doesn’t have built-in WiFi or else has WiFi that might not be ideal for high-quality music streaming.

There are endpoints that have good-quality WiFi (e.g., my exaSound PlayPoint), but they tend to be on the pricey side, and I have the impression that you’re not currently prepared to spend a lot of money on this kind of hardware.

Also, I’m a little loathe to push the AirPort Express very hard, since Apple has exited the network hardware business and all the AirPort gear is discontinued (though you can still pick up refurbished stuff). OTOH, you could pick up a used AE for next to nothing, and that would be easy to hook up in conjunction with your existing AirPort Base station.

So while you’re waiting for your Source, the best recommendations for a reasonably priced endpoint I can come up with are the Sonore Sonicorbiter SE and, if your Bel Canto DAC has a decent coax S/PDIF input, this Allo DigiOne bundle. There are less expensive endpoints, but there’s “some assembly required.”

EoP is Ethernet over your power lines. The adapters are inexpensive, and some people have good luck with it, but I have seen a number of folks posting on this forum who’ve had Roon playback issues related to EoP. It seems as though the Roon guys generally try to steer people away from EoP.

18

Hi,

one ‘gotcha’ that caught me out was the requirement to run Roon remote on a relatively recent iPad or iPhone. My ‘old’ iPad 4 (AKA ‘iPad with Retina display’) was not compatible, so check that yours is by looking here:
https://kb.roonlabs.com/FAQ:_What_models_of_iPhone_and_iPad_can_I_use_Roon_with%3F

1 Like
19

David and Tony thanks for the advice. I’m afraid I am running into the limits of my own understanding of the technical issues involved.

David wrote:
“I wanted to clarify that the Airport Express or other WiFi access point would be in addition to your network endpoint. Oversimplifying, what the access point is doing is giving you a place to plug an Ethernet cable into your WiFi network in the living room.”

Apologies if this is an utterly ignorant question but, I don’t see any way I can use an ethernet cable in my living room. It is not practical to run cable from the room with the iMac (where the ethernet connection is) to the living room. Are you talking about doing something else that I am just not understanding? In the living room the ethernet cable would connect from what to what?

But Tony’s point about the iPad also gives me pause. My iPad is a version 10.3.2. I assume that is the software. The machine was bought about three years ago. That would seem to meet the criteria on the list Tony offered. But I’m not certain and it does make me wonder if I should just wait to do this until my Source either comes through (or falls through entirely, in which case I will purchase something else).

Thanks again!

20

You’d just plug in the WiFi access point to a convenient electrical outlet in your living room.Then you run a short ethernet cable to the ethernet input on your network endpoint. There’s no ethernet cable from the room with the iMac to the living room. Technically — stay with me now — the access point acts as a “bridge,” so there’s a WiFi-to-WiFi link between your AirPort base station and the access point.

Identifying the iPad — If you look at the back of the iPad, there should be a model number. Mine is in microscopic type, but I managed to read it. Once you have the model no., you can Google “ipad model XXXX” and you’ll quickly learn the “common” name for your iPad, which should relate to what’s in the Roon hardware requirements. 10.3.2 is the current version of iOS, so that’s a positive sign. :slight_smile: