Hi Mike, Very interested to know why you chose to Use Windows Server rather than W10. And does it make any practical difference. One of the reasons I ask is that I have a lot of fibre connections in my network, and there are some cheap new Hewlett Packard NICs are available for sale at the moment and I bought one, thinking I could put it into my W10 machine. I then found the drivers for it on the HP site, but they start to install and then roll back, saying they are not designed for W10. So as a consequence, I was wondering whether to convert my W10 machine to a W Server machine?
Mike, just curious, why not run ROCK directly on the HP EliteDesk 800 G4 DM without Windows?
To be honest, I wasnât certain it would work since the HP was not a NUC.
I spent a lot of time reading about OSes, music servers and the noise they create affecting music.
Windows Server 2019 was the quietest, and being a server guy, was not a setup issue for me.
Not against ROCK, just concerned I would have issues.
As for using optical, the HP DM I am using is 7"x7"x1.25" and only can use USB and network for music. I have looked at using network hubs with optical between the ROON server and the music, just not hearing any issues yet.
It might or might not. RoonOS only comes with the drivers for the NUCs on the supported hardware list. While many have gotten it installed on other hardware, those installations are not officially supported. So you would stay in the Tinkering section if you needed help.
I research before attempting it; what I do is look up the support NUCs, detail what chipsets they are using, specifically Network interface and USB. Then I see if the hardware I want to use for RoonOS will work with the same drivers.
I have indeed installed ROCK on a variety of desktop or other small form factor PCs, just to see if I can. But, it is not what I use in any daily driver sense.
And, if you are going to try it, Iâd get another hard drive to experiment with. That way if I donât like it, I can just replace the original drive. A RoonOS install will wipe out the current OS.
We are also an Apple household. For our Roon server, we tried our NAS but the performance was lacklustre. I then built a fanless i5 NUC with ROCK on it and it works like a dream. If youâre getting a computer only for be used as a Roon server, I would really recommend going the NUC route.
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I use an older iMac with a build date of 2011 and running El Capitan (still has the CD loading slot on the side so it is easy for me to transfer from my physical collection to the hard drive) as my Roon core. I no longer update the operating system and all other applications have been removed. The iMac is then connected to a PS Audio NuWave DSD dac which then is connected to my 2 channel system. And I use both Qobuz and Tidal (for now) for streaming with no issues.
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I use a dedicated headless Mac Mini (2014) with 16G RAM and 1T SSD running Catalina and Roon Core. Everything is working flawless! The Mac in the basic configuration (4G RAM and 500G HD) was purchased at Amazon as a refurb item (practically new):
$272.99 for Mac
$128.99 for OWC 1.0TB Mercury Electra 3G SSD
$74.88 for OWC 16.0GB (2x 8GB) PC3-12800 DDR3L 1600MHz
The Mac Mini is running cool 24/7, CPU load 14% (Roon), temperature 35-38 Celsius (95-100 Fahr), RAM usage 30%. Roon is streaming files from my NAS and Tidal, DSP applied (room correction, automatic upsampling).
I was looking for Mac Mini 2014 specifically, because it is a last Mac Mini with the optical output (it is connected to my Cary SD-306 Pro DAC in the main audio rack), also I have two additional zones over Ethernet (Bel Canto e.Stream + C5i and iMac).
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Is the optical output from your 2014 Mini limited to 96KHz? I am actually using an older one currently, and that was a limiting factor with direct connection to my integrated amp.
No, it is limited to 192KHz.
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I do prefer the Mac OS to Windows, but I also happen to have both Windows server 2019 and Windows 10 Home available to me, as well as the chance to turn my 5yr old Win-10-Home machine into a Catalina Hackintosh⌠I donât have an NUC available.
My questions are:
- Which OS would YOU prefer to run Roon Core on.
And⌠- Does the quality of the computer on which Roon Core is installed matter at all?
I prefer the Roon Core on a Linux box. In my case I use a sonicTransporter i9 as I donât want to manage the updates at the kernel level. I let SGC do that as they are fantastic at it. The Core hardware does not seem to matter much if you connect to your DAC using a Roon Endpoint. Ethernet provides great isolation. The quality of the Endpoint is what ends up mattering.
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Yes, you are correct, this is what I have also found.
Iâm trying to learn here, so forgive meâŚ
If the quality of the endpoint is the only thing that matters, is that because the Core actually only acts as a âmanagement deviceâ for controlling what Roon plays, and the streamed signal itself never goes through the Core, it comes from Roonâs or Qobuzâs servers, through oneâs router, ethernet system and out of the endpoint? Meaning that the endpoint is actually the only device that makes a real difference?
Streamed signal? There is no streamed signal. There is streamed data. The DAC is sent the digital data and creates an analog signal that is output to a preamp, integrated amp, or amp.
Letâs assume we are using the Roon Core/Roon Endpoint model here and are playing PCM-based music files. The Roon Core, whether it gets the data from a local disc, network storage, Qobuz, or Tidal, takes the PCM data out of whatever wrapper is used and streams it over RAAT to the Roon Endpoint.
The Roon Core has done all the heavy lifting while the Endpoint is just receiving the PCM stream and passing it to the DAC. The Core is going to make a lot of electrical noise that would be passed along via USB. But, Ethernet blocks most of that noise. A quality Endpoint will have much less electrical noise than the Core so it wonât pass much noise on to the DAC.
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Hi, Speedy⌠Yes, I did realise it was data, not a signal, up to the DAC point. But thank you for that!
So if the Roon Core does all the âheavy liftingâ, and you say that the Core makes a lot of electrical noise, I assume that a better quality unit for the Core WILL make a lot of difference to the integrity of the system. I take your point that ethernet will block much of that noise too.
This is far from a given even if you use a USB connection. Most well designed DACs will deal with USB noise. Network connections via wired ethernet (or wireless) will certainly be fine.
If you do intend to drive something via USB Iâd read up on the device. You could also connect it to a temporary core on a ânoisyâ general purpose PC and test it. Iâd be surprised if you heard anything.
A TOSlink optical is also a great non-conductive connection if itâs an option and noise is a worry, or issue.
@killdozer
I put together an Intel Nuc 7i3 BNH is a Akasa Fanless case with 64GB SSD for the Roon Core. It also holds a 1 TB SSD for the music files.
This is networked to my DAC by Ethernet through the etherREGEN to isolate the noises.
Itâs been a worthwhile investment
Thatâs similar to my own setup, though my NUC is a fairly recent addition. I confess though youâd have to use violence to persuade me to spend that money on the Regen. A standard Ethernet switch at 30x less would work just as well IMHO.
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I use two headphone systems where the DAC is connected to the Roon bridge by USB. They are dead silent. My Oppo 203 is connected to my network by ethernet but is also connected to my Nucleus by HDMI. It is dead silent using either connection. In the past, I used USB from laptop core to DAC. It was dead silent. I think this idea of USB noise is over-blown, but maybe is a problem in some very high-end systems. IDK.
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I think there is a bit of confusion here about what ânoiseâ actually means.
I agree that very often a system seems âsilentâ to the human ear.
We all know the white noise, pink noise, hiss and hum, but the fact that one canât actually hear and identify one of those elements, doesnât actually mean that there arenât artefacts which may NOT be audible, but which directly distort, or whose harmonics distort, the purity of the data in a digital stream, or the signal in an analog sector.