I hope you maybe had a shot of some bourbon or scotch with it 
I think perhaps that even the airing of these concerns would speak to some truth anyway.
At least THAT could be an actual bug 
I don’t agree with censoring the Forum to make Roon look better either. Fortunately I don’t think it’s happening.
Although the allegation is made in broad terms, the evidence seems restricted to threads to do with one issue - folder browsing. So far as I know all the non-infringing posts that have criticised Roon about this issue remain up and can be read by anyone interested enough to search.
In fact, because Roon specifically ask moderators to tread lightly on posts critical of Roon compared to other posts, there are probably marginal or lightly infringing posts that remain up.
After four years in which anyone who wanted to say something about the issue has fully explained their position threads have been closed and moderators asked to refer future posts on the topic to Roon’s published final position.
The problem with continued discussion in threads on this topic is that it steps on the Roon posts and new users can miss them.
Does this constitute censoring the Forum to make Roon look better ? I’d like to think that if I was setting out to do that I’d do a better job than leaving all the critical posts on open display.
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Well, I guess reasonable minds may differ. I would view the suppression of expression on a topic to be censorship unless there is a specific rules violation.
Is it to make Roon look better? I guess that is a question of intent - but it does have that effect, in the sense that if one were shopping for music library software and was poking around Roon, and happened to poke around the forum, the lack of visibility of those threads and their being buried quite deep due to lack of activity certainly isn’t going to tip someone off as to the lack of a standard feature.
Maybe Roon should put, on its marketing site, a prominent section of things you’ll never get with Roon. That would most certainly address my point, albeit a sledgehammer to kill a mosquito.
*That last part is facetious. No need for people to take it literally.
I. Agree, I had a post [on JRiver] in my name that was edited to say something I never said, never complain on that forum it will be deleted or worse !!!
Not quite right. My issue had nothing to do with folder browsing. In fact I dont care about it all.
Hi @bbrip,
You have raised this twice now …
I have some comments to make on this…
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The 1st edit [malicious] was made by a forum user not Roon admin or a moderator.
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This was spotted by a moderator, the change reverted and the offending user warned and demoted.
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It was then changed for a second time [non-malicious], by a different user again not admin or a mod.
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You spotted it first and complained.
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A moderator (me) reverted this edit, and advised that user not to change topic titles in that way even if the intent was an attempt to defuse a hostile topic (to reduce other users piling on).
I believe the above demonstrates that the forum is managed in a proper manner. Of course we can’t please all of the people all of the time … but that goes for life in general not just running an audio forum.
Regards,
Carl
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Sadly, I’m reluctant to comment about roon, bugs, feature ideas, the software, the design, the company, etc. any more because of fanboys piling on and after being rudely spanked by Danny for something or other (he subsequently edited his rudeness).
It’s like a cult of personality. JimH would be proud.
Anyway, as I’ve said before, roon is the worst music playback software/company, except all the others. They’ve done some amazing things. So it’s worth it to me to take the good that far outweighs the bad, and limit my forum participation to helping some other user on the off chance they’re having an issue I know something about from previous experience.
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I also want to add that providing support exclusively via public forum is a double-edged sword. It exposes all your dirty laundry to the world of potential customers. On the other hand, it enlists a community of helpful, knowledgeable users to assist with customer support (bonus: for free!) without having to invest as much in paid support staff, training, overhead, retention, etc.
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Ok, is it normal that any user can just change thread titles as he/she pleases?
This is not what I am used to from other forums and it certainly does not add transparency.
That “warned and demoted” user mentioned in the first two points was me. And I do not apologize for my action. My edit was not “malicious.” It was appropriate because the original and current title of that thread – “Roon is simply unusable for classical collectors” – is a gross exaggeration and sweeping generalization. My edit was intended to be obvious so as not to be attributed falsely to the thread starter. And my edit was designed to bring appropriate qualification – one user’s personal opinion based upon one person’s long standing methods – so as not to speak inordinately for all classical collectors.
For a potential parallel, what if I started a thread entitled “Roon moderators behavior is inconsistent with Roon principal staff members actions and makes this forum unusable”? Would that gross exaggeration and sweeping generalization stand as a thread title?
Or would it not be more appropriate to pose it as a question? “Is Roon moderation consistent between volunteer moderators and principal staff members?” Or try it another way: “I think that Roon moderators actions are not always consistent with Roon staffers actions in this forum”?
On that last count, look at the title of this thread: “I don’t agree with censoring the forum to make Roon look better.” That is appropriately self qualified, much better than declaring that “Roon censorship to make Roon look better makes the forum unusable.” I just hope that the current title of this thread was the original title, not an edit, because that most definitely would be inconsistent moderation.
AJ
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I believe a user who gets to the level of ‘regular member’ has these sort of editing capabilities. They can modify post titles and change the section from one (e.g. Roon Labs LLC) to another (Support).
I haven’t ever tried to see if these capabilities allow a regular user to modify text of a post, but I don’t believe they can.
I’ve been a member for about 5 years and got to “regular member” last year. Don’t know what the criteria are beyond that.
While this type of post title is ridiculous and not taken very seriously (we take it as dealing with a person in an emotionally hot situation and/or an unreasonable personality), it is not against forum rules.
I usually ignore hot-headed topics like that … I think there is a way to talk to get people to listen, and then there is a public rant. I’m sure the poster had some points they felt were valid and interesting, but their method of expressing them didn’t get my attention (or anyone else actually in a position to do something).
Since I’m most likely that principal staff member, I’d probably laugh and leave the title alone!
I read and participated with this thread, and do so with most of @James_I’s posts. Just read that first post! I disagree with his position completely, but seriously, it’s a great example of emotional maturity on the internet.
Is a rule violation a prerequisite for a third party edit to a thread or post in the forums? If so, do even moderators and staff members consistently adhere to that policy? Or could there be situations that are not rule violations, per se, but that warrant an edit here, a nudge there?
Hypothetically, what if somebody were to post a thread titled “Roon is simply unusable for [insert any gender and/or culture]”? Would that be a rule violation? The title could emerge from a person’s legitimately felt complaint based on perceived gender/cultural bias subconsciously built in to Roon software.
But would that thread title be good to appear in the forums? Would it lead to productive discussion? Or would it just push too many buttons? And how would a [insert any gender and/or culture] who happily uses Roon feel about being spoken for and stereotyped in that thread title? Might it be better nudged to something like “Roon exhibits some subconscious gender/cultural biases” or “Do you perceive subconscious bias(es) within Roon software?”
AJ
no, I guess not. sometimes it’s just nice to clean things up
Not so sure this statement is in line with forum rules. Questioning a users mental health I’d call a gross breach of those rules
Are you a classical collectors? Otherwise you may be in ignorance of the issues in question, which have not just brought up by me but by many users mutiple times.
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Dear @bbrip, following all the above I wanted to simply say that I found your thread quite constructive and useful. As a long(-ish) time user of this forum, I appreciate threads like yours as they serve ‘process’ and ‘content’ goals. Such threads enable expression and sharing of one’s frustration / appreciation etc. In my view, Roon attracts music listeners who are truly passionate about the hobby, their gear and Roon itself as a product. This passion extends to this forum and that is quite healthy in my opinion (as long as forum rules are observed). As mentioned above, your thread did not break any forum rules and I am glad (and relieved) that good moderation preserved your expression and thread. I think this is in line with the sentiments and thoughts articulated by @James_I above.
Having said that, I fully respect and understand that this is a forum with rules set by Roon and also appreciate how managing it requires time (cost) and resources which need to be balanced and managed. What matters is that we as users know what are the rules of the forum so that we can make an informed decision on whether to engage or not. As an example, the observations and points raised by @James_I (as well as the subsequent responses and narrative) feel quite important as they help me (re-)evaluate my engagement with this forum.
I hope your thread continues. As mentioned above it is certainly compliant with forum rules. I can relate with some of the expressed frustration and I appreciate the content which helps me think of workarounds to similar issues I have encountered
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It is. There were no personal attacks there at all… I’m explaining how we respond to certain types of posts. Also, let’s not be so dramatic again. Being “hot-headed”, in “an emotionally hot situation”, or being an “unreasonable personality” is not a mental health condition – it’s a character trait.
Unsure what this has to do with censorship. As for my ignorance, there are ways to fix that ignorance… but that initial post in the thread that @WiWavelength edited drove me away. I never made it past post 1.
This thread here is similar, and you see engagement by our team because it was a reasonable statement made by the original poster. It’s too bad you say the content on that thread turned out to be good. There may be good content on the NY Post ( a popular New York area newspaper with ridiculous headlines ), but I don’t get past the “clickbait” headlines.
The lesson to be learned: don’t taint your post by being an ass to the intended audience. I couldn’t walk into an Italian restaurant and say 'The food here is unedible to lovers of pasta" and expect the chefs to listen to me. I’m pretty sure you wouldn’t do that either. There are ways to be heard, but clickbait titles with flippant first posts are not it.
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