microRendu + Chord DAVE DAC play noise randomly when switching sample rate

Support
1

Hi all,

I’m suffer from random playback problem, where the sound playback will randomly become either 1. high freq noise only, or 2. highly distorted music.

It happens randomly when playback switch to a hd sample rate media, for example 24/96 or DSD64 etc, if switch from a hd media to 44.1k sample rate media, it will not occur, seems there is communication error when switching sample rate. I can fix the noise by select “next” on my iPad Roon app to skip to next song until a different sample rate file is play, then the playback will resume normal. If next song is of the same sample rate, I need to skip again until a diff sample rate file is play.

In scenario 1 (only high freq noise is play), the panel on DAVE keep on switching, I record a video here :
https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/17490273/switch%20to%20HD%20media%20plaback%20with%20noise%20only.mp4

For scenario 2, highly distort music is playback, the music playing is 24/176, DAVE shows the correct sample rate :
https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/17490273/switch%20to%20HD%20file%20play%20with%20distored%20sound.mp4

My system is :

Roon server on Synology NAS -> LAN -> switch -> mR -> DAVE

I’ve try swapping USB cable for mR -> DAVE, between Curious Cables USB / AQ Diamond USB, remove the Jitterbug there, both not help.

mR firmware was update from v2.2 to latest v2.3 and does not help, and it was powered by SBooster LPS.

At the mR admin page, the “DAC Diagnostics” shows the sample rate which match the media file I’m playing. DoP support is selected and Roon shows no sample rate conversion whatever media I play.

Here is the “DAC Diagnostics” when scenario 1 (only high freq noise is play) happens, a DSD64 dsf file is playing with high freq noise only, on DAVE the sample rate panel is switching between DSD64 & 176k quickly, as in the first video above.

access: RW_INTERLEAVED
format: S32_LE
subformat: STD
channels: 2
rate: 176400 (176400/1)
period_size: 8820
buffer_size: 17640

This problem does not happen with my previous DAC with the same chain, and was not observed in my first week with DAVE.

Pasted image800×664 66.7 KB

I’ve also try with the Resync Delay, it was at default 0ms for months and working perfectly, I’ve try 50ms & 100ms now, and does not help.

I have my previous Intel NUC + LPS + Win10 machine around, can try to setup to replace mR to see if it helps. Not sure if the Chord DAVE ASIO driver for Windows could help, I take this as last resort as I purchase mR to replace the NUC setup.

Thanks,
Paul

2

Hi Paul,

Thanks for the detailed report. Given that this setup was working for a week and before that ok on a different DAC I wondering what might have changed.

What Synology NAS are you using and what is it’s spec (CPU / RAM).

Are you still able to test with a the other DAC?

I’m leaving a tag here for Roon @support guys to follow up with you. I suspect they will want see view the support package to check out what can be gleam from the logs.

3

My NAS is Synology 713+, Atom 2G Hz CPU / 2G RAM
Roon install on a dedicated SSD drive, and music file on a single disk installed on the NAS.

My previous DAC is sold so can’t test with it.

After the DAVE arrive, there is 2 change I remember.

  1. my NAS is connected to a 1000Mb switch using dual LAN cable, NAS LAN is config as adaptive load balancing, my mR and PC all connect to this switch. After the DAVE arrive, I’ve added a audio grade switch, which run at 100Mb. I connect the mR to the audio switch instead, and connect the audio grade switch to the 1000Mb switch with a single LAN cable.

  2. DAC to amp connection with RCA alone before, just added a XLR, so the DAVE has both RCA & XLR connected to my amp.

I’ve try rollback above config after the problem happens, but I find I can still reproduce the problem, usually within 10 sample rate switching.

The problem happens randomly, even for switch to the same music file, it may not happens every time.

4

If your Synology is located not too far away from the DAVE, you could also try to connect the DAVE directly to the Synology and test if this changes anything.

5

Thanks for the extra details.

That’s quite underspecified* to run Roon, I’m wondering if that’s the cause or at lease contributing to the issue when playing high resolution files.

I would check the loading on the NAS, also try rebooting and checking again. If you can also try reinstating your NUC.

*Recommended [minimum] Hardware Intel Core i3 4GB RAM, (SSD boot drive)

6

I reconnect my NUC last night, which is a i5 + 16GB RAM, install Roon Bridge, and the Chord ASIO driver. This replace my mR, by moving the same lan & USB cable from mR to the NUC. So far there is no problem.
In a few occasion, there is a pop sound when I press next to skip track.

Seems this works better so far, but this stronger bridge has diff OS, drivers, Roon s/w, and DSD transmit in native mode instead of DoP, many factors changed.

During this few months of my usage of Roon on my NAS, I find the CPU / RAM usage is quite low during playback, both < 60%.
I have doubt on such a high NAS requirements u mention in spec, but understand that sometimes the concern is on latency / responsiveness.

Back to your comment, shall I really need to upgrade my NAS, does it relate to whether I use mR or NUC as bridge ?

7

Hi Chris

Just connect my 713+ with a 2m computer USB cable to DAVE, and test extensively for sample rate switching. It works flawlessly, and SQ also surprisingly very good ! Magical !

DSD playback set as DoP in Roon, DSD128 is played without any problem, CPU loading during this is also very low.

8

Just change back from NAS to DAVE direct connection back to using mR, the problem happens again. Tried using a giga switch, and swap to PPA switch (which is 100Mb), both can reproduce the problem within 15 times of sample rate switching.

So the problem seems come from the mR.

9

I’ve move my Roon server from the under spec NAS to my NUC, the search speed using Chinese characters increase a lot, which is same speed as search with English characters now. Furthermore, the occurrence of above music play with noise problem seems much less occurred.
So what’s next I shall do? Will test with increase the Resync Delay.

10

Hi Paul, I am also a Dave user located in HK. May I ask why you choose to use Asio driver from chord other than the async driver?

My current set up:
Synology 916+ w 3x 4T in raid 5 and a 512G SSD as cache
Intel NUC i5 with 16g ram and 512 SSD installed w Roon Server
All to a Buffalo audio switch
Nuc to Intona to Uptone Regen to Dave with USB.

I do experience sampling rate problem sometimes but definitely not serous as you do.

May I ask is there any advantage installing the Room Server on the NAS?

11

Rob has mentioned that their ASIO driver for win has better error handling, which they can ensure bit perfect transmission, and it can send DSD to DAVE in native mode without using DoP, So they recommend it if u play from Win USB to DAVE.

As I stream to microRendu, which sounds better to my hear, my trial with ASIO win driver is mainly for my problem above.

I bought my mR to replace my USB Regen, but I believe your Intona + USB Regen can provide very good result too :slight_smile:

“May I ask is there any advantage installing the Room Server on the NAS?”
Mainly is simplicity, to reduce the computer gear around, and have a easier life no need to power on computer before i can listen to music. Also for Roon design, I heard about there is a concept of local storage,

I just further move my 3T music file HDD and Roon server to my main PC, which is a powerful i5 for my daily use. The operation performance is further improved.

12

Great stuff. I may really need to grab an external SSD for the Roon DB and try out Roon on the NAS.

Are you also using HQ Player or simply the default player for now?

13

Hi Paul,
I’ve been using Roon for about 6 months but have never posted here. I read about your problem with the Chord Dave and thought I should comment. I have what sounds like the same problem of very distorted music when a song at a different sample rate plays, and I also have a Chord product. My setup is Roon on a MacPro desktop direct USB to a Chord 2Qute. I don’t think the problem occurs 100% of the time when a sample rate change occurs, but I’m not positive of that. Like you if I hit the advance button on my iPad it straightens things out (as long as its not the same sample rate again). I have not seen this problem using the same hardware but playing back with Audirvana. I thought you should know I’m experiencing the same or a very similar problem but without an NAS or Mrendu in my system.

14

Thx a lot for your sharing.
As I have use other DAC with Roon, and you have try other software players with Chord, I believe there is some magic between Chord and Roon which will trigger the problem more easily. I’m trying with 500ms resync delay and see if the situation improves.

15

Hi William,
My installation of Roon on my 713+ is on a dedicated Sandisk Extreme Pro SSD in a internal NAS slot. Unfortunately I see no performance difference compare with install to other HDD volume inside the NAS.

Forgot to mention, I also moved this SSD to my main PC for installation of win10 and Roon server now.

16

Hi Jeff,
I still experiment with different setup. Roon on PC instead of NAS, local music instead of NAS, Roon bridge install on NUC instead of mR, which use the Chord DAVE ASIO windows driver. Configure the resync delay to 0.5s. But this problem is still happening randomly to me.

Seems Chord DAC is more sensitive / intolerant with my Roon / mR combination, which has been working perfectly with my previous meitner ma-1.

Btw, I heard that there is Roon tested program. And Chord DAVE seems not on the list yet, can it help if Roon Chord work together on this?

17

I’ve switch to Minimserver on NAS, stream to JPlay Streamer on NUC for a few days, which is my previous config before Roon. And the above problem with DAVE does not happens anymore.

Maybe I’ve to stay with this and revisit Roon later.

18

Chord is fairly responsive about most issues - would be great if Roon and Chord would work together and get this fixed since both products are attractive to folks who are willing to spend a bit more money for quality.

19

Yes, hope they can fix it one day. Weeks has passed, below DLNA streaming system is rock solid. With the test I’ve done for far, I can’t confirm mR is the cause, sorry for the subject.

Minimserver on Synology NAS
JPlayStreamer on NUC (Win10, Chord DAVE ASIO driver)

But I still miss the Roon interface, its Tidal integration, and the SQ with HQP.
As HQP has no remote control apps, using with Roon is the best choice for it. Quite Roon force me to quite HQP as well, they really improve each others.

20

On further test, I find that using the “Chord Async USB 44.1kHz - 768kHz” WASAPI device instead of the Chord ASIO driver fixed the problem. People say that ASIO is better if vendor has one, but Roon seems handle WASAPI better, even the Linux driver in mR has problem work with DAVE.

Furthermore, if use with HQP, and in the HQP config, select “Chord Async USB 44.1kHz - 768kHz” WASAPI also works like a charm, where it has the same problem if I select the ASIO and USB out to DAVE directly, or select NAA and stream through mR.