I’ve just started playing DSDs through Roon and have had some troubles applying convolution. When I choose the “Enable Native DSD Processing” setting the music comes out of the left channel (there is a bit coming out of the right but it’s very quiet). If I leave this setting off then music plays as expected.
I’m running Roon Linus server V269 with endpoint a Ropiee Pi2 V061-1. My DAC can accept native DSD.
I would like to add a screen shoot of the signal paths that work and those that don’t but I cannot seem to get it to work - apologies.
Am I doing something nothing wrong? Other than this roon is working like a dream.
Hi @John_Rusjan ---- Thank you for the report and sharing your observations with us. The feedback is always appreciated!
Moving forward, can you please drop me a screenshot of the signal path leaving Roon when you make the observation noted in your post above?
EDIT: @andybob thank you for the screenshot advice!
Are you having trouble capturing the screenshot or uploading it into a post ?
If the first, what kind of Control device are you using ? An iPad will take a screenshot and save it to Photos (via a Drawing app) if you hold the side button and press the front button.
If uploading, use the up arrow icon in the post editor. Your device is selected by default, press Choose Files and select the screenshot you just made.
thanks for getting back to me so quickly. Since my initial post I’ve done some further investigation to see if the behaviour is consistent across different instances of roon core - firstly on a unix box and secondly on a iMac. In both cases the behaviour is the same.
So, now with screen shots, here is what is happening.
Currently running roon core on iMac 3.2 GHz Intel Core i5, macOS 10.13
Endpoint is Ropiee Pi2 V061-1
DAC is Vitus card DAC in RI-100 which in roon is described as JLsounds Hi-Rez Audio 2.0
Configuration of device is:
If I do not do anything to the signal path
and I play a DSD this is the path I see and everything is fine, music plays as expected.
Now if I turn on convolution only, then the music stops coming out of the speakers but roon indicates the music is still playing. The path is this:
Q: Why is does roon convert DSD to PCM at this point?
Now if I turn on Sample Rate Conversion
the music again plays out of the speakers and path is this:
Note the GREEN dot.
Now finally if I switch on Native DSD Processing,
the audio comes out of the left speaker. The path is now:
I hope that is enough information but if not please let me know.
Thanks again for your quick replies.
I have the same behaviour in my system. ROCK (NUC7 i7, 131k taps convolution)->Bryston DBP-2->Naim DAC (SPDIF). Signal path looks the same as in previous post.
Just as another data point I tried plugging the DAC directly into the iMac (via USB) just to check if it wasn’t the Ropieee and the behaviour is unchanged.
One more data point.
If I take all processing out of the loop.
And play, the path looks like this and all is good.
Now if I turn on the Speak Setup and add some gain (can be any non-zero number)
I get the following path (note the green dot) and music stops coming out of the speakers but roon thinks it is playing.
I hope that helps diagnose the issue.
I hope the screenshots are of some help.
Hi @John_Rusjan ----- Thank you for the very detailed feedback, very appreciated!
Moving forward, I would like to see if we can reproduce this behavior on our end and would like to kindly ask you for the following information/materials:
A copy of the convolution filter being used in a “shared” dropbox link.
I have a fairly good sense from your screenshots about what your “playback” and DSP engine settings are BUT if there is any information missing please let us know. The idea is to match all of your settings when we go to test.
I would also like a media sample (via the same method mentioned in my first bullet point) that readily experiences this behavior when the filter is being applied. Furthermore, and this is more of a general question, when you do notice this issue are you playing the same type of media each time (i.e sample rate, etc)?
Hi @Carmen_Marin ---- Thanks for the chiming in and sharing your observations with me. The additional insight is greatly appreciated!
As I have asked, John. Would you kindly provide me with the following:
In response to your questions…
I’ve added convolution and DSD track to my Drop Box. Can you please provide an email address and I’ll send you the link.
I’m pretty sure that I have provided everything but then again I’m not an expert. Here is some additional info.
- This behaviour occurs everything that I play a DSD but it is not solely dependant on the convolution being enabled. As mentioned in the earlier post, roon will exhibit the same behaviour if the convolution is disabled and any volume adjustments are made in Headroom Management or Speaker Set Up. However, if in Speaker Setup a delay is introduced then there is no adverse effect.
Playing around I have also noticed similar problems when I try using DoP instead and I can provide that information if you think it may be useful.
I hope that is helpful,
one more screen shot that might help.
In my system, this issue happens with DSD files, Convolution ON (131k taps filter), Sample Rate Conversion OFF and Enable Native DSD Processing ON. When using Sample Rate Conversion OFF and Enable Native DSD processing OFF, everything is ok (not sure why this happens as the Sample Rate Conversion is OFF in both cases).
I would gladly attach the screenshots, but I have no idea how to do it and I don’t have a Dropbox account.
Thanks for getting back to me @John_Rusjan, very appreciated!
Are you be able to use the instructions in the hyperlink above (i.e "shared dropbox link) to share the content with me?
From the link:
Let me know, thanks!
Hi @Carmen_Marin ---- In order to share screenshots with us you have two options…
You can drag the screenshot directly in to the box where you are typing your reply OR you can use the “upload” function:
@John_Rusjan and @Carmen_Marin ---- Thank you both for the feedback and insight here!
John, I received the requested materials Thank you again for that.
Moving forward, to bring you both up to speed, I touched based with some of our techs today and was informed that the team is aware of this behavior and are currently working on it.
Once I have a better sense of their progress I will be sure to update this thread accordingly. Your continued patience is greatly appreciated!
thanks for getting back to me. I’m very glad(?) to hear that it is an issue in roon rather than an artefact of my system being too slow (which was my fear).
Your response has been terrific.
I also reported the same issue with @Eric. (with another ticket opened)
This is what I tested:
So I did more extensive test about the issue by loading the WAV file individually (WITH Native DSD Processing ON)
Thanks to the latest build I was able to play with Convolution ON using all of the filters even at 4205k taps (with 44.1 WAV Filter)
Here is what I found from my individual filter test.
44.1 WAV Filter slight bias to the left
48 WAV Filter NO SOUND
88 WAV Filter slight bias to the right
96 WAV Filter NO SOUND
176 WAV Filter VERY MUCH bias to the left (the right speaker is significant lower in volume)
192 WAVE Filter NO SOUND
352 WAV Filter VERY MUCH bias to the right (the left speak is significant lower in volume)
384 WAV Filter No SOUND
Again, without Native DSD Processing ON, sounds all good with , no crosstalk.
Also, I tried playing these filters with their respective frequency PCM files and no crosstalk neither.
Right now, have Native DSD off to resolve the issue.
NUC7i7BNH with ROCK
Devialet Expert 200