I’m running an MSB Premier now, I was using a Weiss Medus 2 weeks ago.
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I agree with @Ralf_Ortmanns that ‘it depends’.
I’ve been a computer audio user for many years.
My early squeezebox used with a @Sheldon_Stokes valve DAC (which didn’t reclock) definitely didn’t sound as good as with my Meridian CD transport.
A later squeezebox with better clocking was much better.
Using Apple iTunes from a Mac into a Musical Fidelity M6 dac (which did reclock) sounded the same as when driven by the Meridian, but some Apple OS versions would struggle to maintain USB audio output - so there would be occasional dropouts.
I’ve never had a dropout from Ropieee / Roon Bridge. I haven’t extensively tested ROCK direct into a USB dac, but I’ll bet Roon have got this right.
My current RME DAC isn’t galvanically isolated, so when driving an unbalanced output from a Mac I could hear power supply noise leaking into the audio output. An Intona USB isolator fixed this.
Driving the same RME dac from a raspberry Pi - I’ve never had this - and I don’t think the Intona makes any difference.
My feeling is Roon’s best audio advice is ‘sufficient but not necessary’. You may not need to do what they advise, but it certainly avoids some of the problems I’ve seen before.
I use better SM power supplies (Allo and Meanwell) for my raspberry Pis. Not sure this makes a difference, but they were pretty inexpensive.
So again - I think the answer is ‘it depends’!
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I should also add that my Roon core is on a Mac Mini M2Pro in a very electrically noisy environment, it sits in a cupboard with my 10G and 1G network switches, router, NAS and Video surveillance system.
I bought the Lumin U2 for the isolation afforded by the fibre 1G network connection. The signal is further isolated by the MSB through its USB optical isolation system.
I had no idea the difference the Lumin would make to the sound and I was pretty surprised given the sceptic I am.
The biggest difference s to a sound system, in my experience, are speaker setup, room treatment, speaker quality, well matched components and then individual component quality.
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i agree, the room treatment was the biggest improvement for me
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I’m about 50% there at a guess, I’ve over deadened the room, it’s perfect for home theatre but a bit dead for music. I’m half way through preparing my absorption to include diffusion, I’m facing half my absorption with BAD.
i was in the same position. in my first listening room (which was pretty small) i also over did it. moving in the basement into a new dedicated listening room, i requested a room audio planing from a professional company. they calculated everything to get 90% of reflections down but also implement difusion so i got a live end - dead end scenario… it sounds perfect! also calculating speaker placement based on cardas changed everything how all sounds!
I’ve been streaming (local/remote) since 2005. I have used many pieces of software like iTunes, pure music, audirvana, and roon using servers attached to an external dac using usb and with an Auralic Aries streamer using the Lumin and Lightning DS software attached to an external dac using usb. All this while I was using all the different USB tweaks/gimmicks to make USB sound better.
I sold all that and went with Roon on a server in another room from my dedicated audio room and got a great sounding dac with Ethernet input. I’m done! So much simpler with much better sq.
IMO, the biggest increase in Sq was to use Ethernet into the dac and second, the software you run makes a noticeable difference. Roon and Audirvana are the top 2 apps that I like
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hi, thanks for your answer. the more i read, the more i am questioning everything :). when i look at devices that are only streamers (because i actualy think the the chord qutest dac is so good, i want to keep it) i ask myself if they have some magic usb interconnect that are way better then a raspberry pi (that i already use as a roon bridge). of course i could connect a new streamer via optical, but that would be the only real change i can make. the chord qutest does not have ethernet input, so that is not an option. so i really struggle to understand why i should spend more the 1000 euro for a better “usb” connect. i do not see any other thing (sound related) that other streamers can offer that a raspberry can not. but perhaps i miss something here.
Hi there, if you look at streamers, they are just a computer running a proprietary OS. A lot of them have gimmicks like large SSDs for caching, what a waste. I do think they try to provide a better usb connection isn’t that usb audio 2.0, but that’s it. I’ve used a $50k server with 256g of ram, all enterprise solid state storage (ssd and nvme) with a couple different Linux OSs installed and didn’t get any better sq than using a simpler server with normal hdds and SSD’s/nvme components.
When I was using usb, the biggest improvement was using an audioquest Diamond cable, this was maybe 6 years ago or more. I had devices that reclocked the signal, femto clocks, etc, and none of this mattered as much as a better cable
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Don’t let fear, uncertainty and doubt get the best of you.
Dismiss endlessly repeated subjectivist anecdotal reports about worthwhile, definitive, jaw dropping, you-name-it improvements without any hard proof.
Manufacturers, reviewers, influencers and owners all have their own agenda.
If there are no audible amusical noises from your setup, there’s literally nothing you could add on the digital side of things - other than DSP for room/speaker correction - to improve on those audiophile jargon listening impressions.
… putting on my asbestos suit now …
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what a great post! this is the messsage that i needed. thank you!
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I’m really wanting a product like the iFi Neo Stream but without a DAC to be released, I would be really interested to see if there are benefits to an internal fiber optic network connection over an external converter box.
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If you have the opportunity to put a decent streamer in your system and evaluate it, do so. That isn’t fear, uncertainty or doubt. It is just making your own mind up. It doesn’t matter what you decide after to anyone but you. But if you say you tried one and it didn’t work for you that is fine. It is subjectivist and and anecdotal but not the end of the world. Ultimately that is how decisions of this sort are made if you are genuinely curious about any differences there may be.
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I am a big fan of Chord Electronics and also raspberry pi solutions, via hifiberry digi/dac.
I am a little crazy though.
Currently enjoying 2yu/2go for USB connection to chord qutest
I do Spotify connect via ripi4 and digi pro.
When using the 2Go/2yu USB connection, I have to boot on spdif connection and then switch to USB. This may be because of the mscaler in the system.
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Well, it depends on the streamer’s various bells and whistles, but in general, you are not missing anything. A Raspberry Pi 4 running RoPieee is a very quiet and effective streamer just using its USB outputs. The Pi 3B+ had an unfortunate design flaw if you wanted to use Ethernet and USB simultaneously, but was otherwise fine.
A streamer does not need “to be designed for audio”. Because it’s not audio, it’s digital. There is no “noisy CPU environment” to consider, because you’re on the digital side of the house, not the analog, and because CPUs are no longer noisy – it wastes power to be noisy, and modern CPUs are designed to be stingy with every microwatt.
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With raspberry pi 3, a digi hat provides a good solution. The allo bridge is very good and it uses a raspberry pi 3 module.
When suggesting a Raspberry Pi as a solution, keep in mind the problems with stock and pricing that have been a big problem for quite some time.
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I hear that stock is expected to improve later this year. Just the same, I started a thread about an inexpensive alternative I’ve been playing with a while back.
It already has. I’m seeing more options on amazon and at half the price I paid a few weeks ago.
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This is an endless debate in audio - everything from a humble RPi to $20K streamers.
I haven’t found it to make a big difference if you have a DAC that has good isolation on the USB port. Most today do, especially the ones that aren’t very cheap (but even some of those do).
I do use a streamer - but mostly for convenience and features. It lets me more easily switch between Roon, HQP, and LMS. I also wanted something a bit larger and heavier than a typical Pi. The Pi was so small it wasn’t physically stable with the various cables attached. Just didn’t like that.
As noted, a streamer can also give you more connectivity.
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