Challenge (not working):
Not playing 24-92 and 24-192 music files on C2000 with NUCLEUS+.
Remark:
24-92 and 24-192 music files are saved on NUCLEUS+ SSD .
So when I push to play looks that files can not be penetrate by Roon to C2000 and looks as bug. Strange is when the Roon doing DSD sample rate conversion C2000 playing 24-176.4
If I use my laptop C2000 playing normally all 24-92 and 24-192 music files. So here I assume that is nothing wrong with TAD-C2000 DAC.
I will very appreciated your ideas and advice what to do or is it some hint in setup? I tried to find out and w/o success.
The nucleus is a Linux device and the TAD page shows the higher rates are dependent on the operating system used. You can get the rates via your laptop which I presume is a Mac or Windows which would seem to point to the OS on the nucleus.
For a DAC to be supported on Nucleus the DAC needs to be supported in the Linux kernel. If the DAC needs special drivers which this does but does not provide them for Linux then it wonât be supported properly.
Thank you very much for your prompt replay and attention.
While using USB 2.0 mode the C2000 achieves the same rates as Mac and also with Linux 192 is no problem at all.
As TAD Agent in the region we have also possibilities to try with TAD-D1000 (PreAmp, SACD, DAC) and everything work nice and smoothly (USB2). Please see the picture where we play music format with DSD rates. Also all 24-92 and 24-192 performed very well.
The C2000 and D1000 have more or less the same DAC-Chip and actually the SAME USB Chipset. So the ONLY difference regarding the file formats is DSD. Well also my NUCLEUS+ see the C2000 and D1000 as the same device. I also discussed with my TAD colleague who is also using NUC+ & Roon and to bet honest, the TAD DACs and the Roon in 99.9% work like a charm and Linux & NUC+ are not bottleneck.
Especial because of all collected informationâs is really mystery and paradox why C2000 block at 24-96 and 24-192?. Perhaps Gentlemenâs from Roon Support team has some hidden card in the hand. P.S.: I also add picture as evidence that conversion file 24-176.4 perform well on C2000.
In the screenshot it appears that you are playing non-DSD content, just to confirm, the signal path you posted above, is this when the music is working or when there are issues?
Are you still using Roon in this case or are you using another app (or the laptopâs System Output)?
I checked the TAD C200 Manual and Iâm not seeing any indication that this DAC supports DSD input. I assume you are trying to play DXD as @Rugby noted?
What exactly happens when you try playing these kinds of files? Do you get an error message? Do the files appear to be playing (progress bar moves) and there is no sound?
Thank you very much for your head up and attention. I made few pictures from the TAD C2000 yesterday. I am using NUC+, Roon, TP-Link MR600 router and iPad. The HD music files are loaded on SSD which in NUC+. All connection cables between the gears are reliable and very good.
The set-up normally playing FLAC 24-176,4 and DSF DSD64 (see the pictures below=>from Roon and C2000/USB2). Also is no problems with playing 16bit => lower resolution.
Mystery happened when we like to play only 24-94 and 24-192 files. When we select album push Play bottom on the Roon shows as very fast forwarding playing thrue all songs on album. As U see on pictures below, C2000 said NO IMPUT, Roon NOTHING PLAYING. We have also short video, but donât know how to attached you?.
P.S.: Forgot to answer => when we us laptop for 24-92 and 24-192 we donât use Roon but FOOBAR 2000 media player. If we use Roon we have the same challenge as describe up.
If you upload it to Dropbox / Google Drive / Send.firefox.com, you can post a link here, but I think I have the general idea of the issue.
It appears that this behavior only occurs when playing these specific types of files on multiples of 48kHz sample rates. If you upsample all of you content to 176kHz, does the same behavior still occur? You can upsample all the content in the DSP Engine like so and I would also reboot your Nucleus after enabling this feature:
RESULTS => all files by different rates start behaver with no playing /no impute (C2000) and fast forwarding jumping. As before on 24-94 and 24-192 files but now on all files rates. Please see/download files from Dropbox link:
Sorry to bothering you but like to proper set up that Roon will work with NUC+ at my TAD presentation to potential customers.
Thank you very much for your replay and have a good day. RGDS, Rok
You said that 176.4 works for you. Instead of setting things to Max PCM Rate in Sample Rate Conversion, try choosing Custom, and for those rates with donât work, like 24/96 and 24/192, set them to be changed to 176.4. See if that then lets you play those files.
I am happy for these first step/success. Thank you very much.
My next concern and chaange is in direction how can our C2000 play HD files 24-96 and 24-192 with out conversions? By our TAD system & demonstration to the Clients (together with NUC+ and Roon) we would like be confident that system penetrate all fileâs rate smoothly.
By my understanding the conversions is not a real solution, especially because converting something from 192 to 176 means some complicated mathematical operations⌠itâs one thing to convert 44.1 to 88.2 to 176.4 and back, but a different story to convert 192 to 176.
Please advice how do you see and what can be done more?
Cheers, Rok
P.S.: 28/11/2019 we will have TAD Listening session in Ljubljana/Slovenia. Always worm welcome when ever you are around.
Glad to hear that 176kHz re-sampled content is working as expected!
I enabled diagnostics mode for your Nucleus and what this action does is automatically upload a set of logs to our servers for analysis.
I discussed the logs with the technical team and it appears that your DAC is informing the Nucleus that it does not support 192/96 content.
I would like to next take a look at the tests you ran on your PC when it was acting as the Roon Core.
With Foobar in this case, were you using the WASAPI or ASIO driver? Was Foobar using Exclusive Mode? You would need to download the Foobar Exclusive Mode addon to ensure that the driver operates in Exclusive Mode, can you confirm you used this addon when performing your testing?
Also, if you use your Laptop to host the Roon Core (not just use it to control your Nucleus), do you experience the same behavior? To clarify on this, I mean:
On the laptop, go to Roon Settings -> General and press disconnect
On the âChoose your Coreâ screen, press âUse this PCâ
Verify if the same behavior occurs for both the ASIO/WASAPI driver when playing 96/192 content when the Laptop is the Roon Core
P.S. Thank you for the invite to the event! Respectfully, I will have to decline since I wonât be in Europe in the near future but I really do appreciate the offer!
sorry for my late follow up but previous week I was pretty busy and also took small vacation. From further on will be my response faster.
I did my home work and please find my outcome:
CONCLUSIONS:
Using the Laptop (X240) as hardware for Roon Core and FOOBAR2000 playing all file rates include 23-96 and 24-192 smoothly w/o hesitating on C2000.
I hope to summarized and collect enough information for next development to solve case with NUC+.
Looking forward your replay and thank you very much for you next efforts.
Thank you for running those tests, it is appreciated. From your testing, we can conclude that this issue only affect Linux-based Roon Cores and it appears to be a Linux driver limitation.
I spoke to our hardware team today regarding your testing and we plan to reach out to TAD to see if they can assist further with this behavior.
We appreciate all the testing you have done so far and for assisting with diagnostics gathering, I will be sure to let you know once I have any further news to share.
One more think => your technical developing department can any time contact my TAD colleague regarding more TAD technical support @ connection with JPN.
[Moderated, contact details sent by PM]
P.S.: Please take attention / into consider that at same chipset my NUC+ works very well (play all file rates) on TAD D1000 gear. Also our TAD colleague from Sweden has also NUC and w/o problems playing HD files on his C2000. Do you think that something changed from one NUC generation to another?
P.S.: I also add picture as evidence that conversion file 24-176.4 perform well on C2000.
Please see result below:
