@noris I have the same experience as @Alberto_Medioli. In my case the Qobuz stream 24/192 stops after 15 seconds (yesterday it was after 9 seconds). All other qualities are streaming without problems. I also have a free trial. I cannot imagin that my ISP internet connection is the bottleneck (a working 250 Mbit connection).
Can you please try to play a track on the Qobuz web player (https://play.qobuz.com) and let me know if it plays all the way until the end?
Thanks,
Noris
@noris With Qobuz webplayer there is no problem. A few moments I played on my iPad until the end Stevie Wonder’s As on the album Songs In The Key of Life (more than 7 minutes) with 24/192.
With Roon it stops after 15 seconds (today). Roon core is running on Synology NAS 713+ with 2Gb memory.
I noticed something strange. With Roon the stream is playing until the end when: I pause the playback after 5 seconds from the beginning of the song and I then resume playing after a while. Furthermore I noticed that at the beginning of the song the CPU usage climbs to 90% and after that goes back to a normal percentage.
From your description, it could be that pausing the track allows buffering to take place, the track continuing to be downloaded as a stream from Qobuz into Roon.
I notice that if I use the Qobuz desktop app, the progress bar shows this buffering in realtime. There’s a light blue bar indicating the downloading, and a darker blue bar indicating the playback progress. As long as the light blue bar keeps ahead of the darker blue, the track plays without problems, but if not, stuttering or dropouts occur.
Yet it’s strange that you had no issue using the Qobuz web player.
Now, I don’t have a 250 Mbps connection, only a 4G mobile router, which gives (depending on network congestion) anything between 9 and 20 Mbps. So it’s OK for CD quality streams, but a gamble for Hi-Res streams.
One thing you could try is to set the DNS server settings in your router to either Google (8.8.8.8) or Cloudflare (1.1.1.1) instead of those of your ISP. I did that on my router, and it has certainly helped.
@noris, pardon me for jumping in…
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@Geoff_Coupe, with Qobuz webplayer the light blue bar keeps far ahead from the dark blue bar. So the internet connection speed shouldn’t be the problem. In my router I already have set the DNS settings to the IP-addresses 8.8.8.8 and 8.8.4.4 (both from Google).
@noris, in theorie it is possible that the CPU on my Synology DS713+ does not have enough power. But than should others do not have the same problem. And furthermore I am asking myself if it is true that 24/192 files are asking much more computer power than 24/96 files and if so how come that the playback is normal if I pause the playback a short period of time at the beginsignaal of the song? Do you have suggestions for further testing?
Hello @noris,
I did the investigations you asked for, although my streaming problems have to do with Qobuz hires 24/192 (see the earlier posts). I got the following results with playing the track Assume Form by James Blake (all until the track has concluded).
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Track plays without problems on the Qobuz web player and the Tidal player app on Windows 10.
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Track plays without problems in Roon from Qobuz.
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Track plays without problems in Roon from Tidal.
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N/A: streams are playing correct
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I have Qobuz Studio (free trial) and Tidal HiFi tiers
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Screenshots playing Qobuz and Tidal:
I also tested the hi-res track “I Wish” from Stevie Wonder on the album “Songs in the Key of Life”. On Qobuz it was 24/194 and with Tidal MQA. The results are as follows:
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Track plays without problems on the Qobuz web player and the Tidal player app on Windows 10.
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Track stops after 9 seconds in Roon from Qobuz (timestamp 10.45AM on 1/27/19). When I pause playing (for a few moments) after playing 3 seconds, the track will play until the end.
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Track plays without problems in Roon from Tidal.
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Loggin out and going back into Qobuz does not help to resolve the play back issue in Qobuz
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I have Qobuz Studio (free trial) and Tidal HiFi tiers
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Screenshots playing Qobuz and Tidal:
Hello @Alfred_van_Hoorn,
Thanks for providing that information.
Now that we have timestamps listed, I have gone ahead and enabled diagnostics mode for your account and what this action will do is next time your Core is active, a set of logs will automatically be generated and uploaded to our servers for analysis.
I kindly ask you to leave your Core powered on and connected to the internet. Once the diagnostics are received by our servers I will take a look at the timestamps you noted to see if Roon is displaying any issues.
Thanks,
Noris
Hi @noris,
I did what you asked for.
My server with Roon running is always on. But earlier this day our cleaning lady accidentally disconnected my SSD disk with the Roon database. So I do not know if your servers has received a complete logfile.
Therefore this evening (07:34PM on 1/29/19) I played the 24/192 track As from Stevie Wonder. Same results. After 9 seconds playing stops.
I hope that you have enough information for now.
Best regards!
Alfred
Hello @Alfred_van_Hoorn,
Thanks for providing those timestamps.
From what I see, this looks to be some kind of performance or networking issue. I am often seeing that your track buffers are not being filled in time and am seeing “sleeping in read” which indicates that the track stream is not reaching the endpoint in time causing a dropout.
You can read more regarding these issues in our KB Article here but I think it would be a worthwhile test to see if another machine is able to reproduce this issue, that way we can narrow it down a bit.
Do you by any chance have another more powerful machine computer around the house which you can use to temporarily host your Roon Core on to see if the same behavior occurs? If you do I would unplug the Synology and connect the machine in the same way that the Synology is connected and try playback to the same endpoint.
Please let me know if this is possible and your results + timestamps if you run this test.
Thanks,
Noris
Hi @noris,
Many thanks for your clear reply!
Based on your suggestions I installed Roon on a old laptop with an Intel I7 processor (Q740, 1,73GHz) with 8 Gb memory running Windows 10. For the internet connection I unplugged the Synology and connected the ethernet cable to the laptop. Furthermore I unplugged the USB cable from the Synology and put it in the laptop.
Playing the same 24/194 music as earlier before (on the Synlogy) now gives no problems (timestamps 11:09AM on 1/30/2019 and minutes before that). I am not shure what I have to concluded from this test but it seems to me that the network(connections) gives no problem. So it has to be with the Synology or Roon running on that.
One possiblity is that the Synology lacks CPU power. If so, than it is strange to me that the 24/192 files are playing normal on the Synology if I stops playback after about 3 seconds from the beginning of the song and resumes playback after 5-10 seconds. If the Synology lacks CPU power then I expects that playback in that case also stops. Or am I wrong about that?
If I am right with this conclusion than is Roon probably causing the playback problems. For example: why is Roon consuming much CPU power only at the beginning of the song? And does it that only for 24/192 files?
I am curious to hear your opinion about this. Are you recognizing these problems? Probably you have more suggestions for more testing. In any case thanks for your time and attention!
For your convenience I attached a picture of the signal path. Furthermore I noticed that the sound quality playing via USB on the Synology is much more better than playing via USB on the Windows 10 laptop.
Best regards,
Alfred
Hello @noris,
Probably you have missed my reply on your questions. I would be glad if you could take a look at it. Hopefully you have further suggestions.
Best regards.
Hi Alfred,
Can you please try adding in some “Resync Delay” to see if this will help when streaming from the Synology? Maybe somewhere between 500ms to 1s to see if that will help with anything. Do you by any chance have the option for “Event Driven Mode” under advanced? This may be worth a try as well. I am also wondering if this could be caused by too many apps running on the Synology, I would use these instructions to turn the one’s not in current use off.
Thanks for your reply!!
I tried your suggestions but none of them gives a solution. I tried Resync Delay up to 10 seconds. It does not make any difference. Furthermore the option “Event Driven mode” is not available. Stopping apps on the Synology does not help.
I wrote earlier that it is unclear to me why it is helping when I pause the playing of a song about 3 seconds or so after the beginning. There are no problems with my network (see earlier tests), And if the CPU power is the problem, I would expect that playing is also a problem after pausing the song. I am curious to hear about your thoughts about this phenomenon. Until now you did not wrote about this. Thanks in advance!
Best regards,
Alfred
I have split your posts into it’s own thread to focus on this issue more in depth. I’m looking back over the thread now and I noticed that you mentioned that the Synology only has 2GB of RAM:
I would say that this issue likely has something to do with the fact that the Synology does not meet the Recommended Roon Specifications.
The way that Roon works is that it buffers the entire track first and I’m thinking that your Synology might be running out of RAM to buffer in and also start playback at the same time.
Playback after the song is already loaded should work as expected but I think that initial loading behavior could be causing the slowdown here since buffering 24/192 is a large task for a duel core processor with only 2GB of RAM.
There are a few more things you can try here to see if they will help, located in Device Setup:
- Enable “Use Maximum Buffer Size”
- Enable “Use Power-of-2 Buffer Sizes”
- Disable MQA Core Decoder
I would try these one by one and then possibly different variations, but at the end of the day we’re trying to squeeze more performance from a Core that does not meet the minimum specifications for high-resolution content. Please let me know if any of my suggestions help!
Thanks,
Noris
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