Too many people in audio forums, friends and even Facebook groups don’t understand the naming nomenclature nor the implementation of your products.
Several years ago, I purchased an HP Stream, which proved far too under powered to run Core. Yesterday I decided to use it for Roon Remote. WHAT? You can’t install Roon Remote on Windows 10? Seriously?
So I grabbed the Core (Roon?) installer and tried anyway. There doesn’t appear to be any documentation that you can do this, as long as you don’t try and run it as a second Core. Now I have a useful HP Stream that works as Roon Remote, and you (still) have a confused user base.
You really need to work on disseminating all the installation possibilities for Roon products. Your stuff is far too good to leave the public confused.
The control point software is Roon for PC. It is both a client and server or just a client depending on what you chose during the install. When you tell it to not install the core and instead to link to an already existing core, I refer to this as setting up a Roon Client and what you needed for the HP.
Roon Remote is for iOS and Android mobile phone or tablet installations, not PCs.
And they do have a FAQ about this, the link is at the top of the download page.
I’ve had a think about this, and I do think it is not entirely correct. Living in a time when ‘reading the manual’ is becoming more important, I think if that were done then there would be no mystery about Roon. From day one I knew what was needed to run a core. And that Roon Remote was for phones and tablet. But I read up on everything I use prodigiously. The information is all there.
I was actually wondering that myself. I wanted to know if I purchase a Nucleus to run the Roon core, will I be able to use my Dell laptop as a controller? I prefer it to my iPhone or iPad.
So, would I need to unstall Roon from my laptop and reinstall as just a control device?
I understand you know this Daniel, but your customers don’t. I looked in this very forum last night, and found posts that stated “you can’t run Remote on Windows”.
My point is that your product naming, description and documentation are confusing. How many people ask “do I need to install Core if I install ROCK?”. These issues are easily clarified if you look at this from the point of the potential customer.
I am not a Roon employee, the moderators are volunteers, so I am just another user like you. I have just used Roon since 2015 so I am pretty well versed.
I do agree that it can be confusing to some people. And perhaps a better description of the different types of installs, Roon as Server and Client vs Roon as Client, be presented.
It doesn’t help when other users mis-use the actual nomenclature and refer to Roon installed as a Client as Roon Remote. In fact, I corrected that in another thread earlier today.
As a complete new person to Roon, the first thing I did was read the excellent documentation to get an understanding, and then asked a couple of questions here to check my new found understanding was correct. Bought a NUC and Raspberry Pi and a HiFiBerry HAT, and using the setup documentation assembled the hardware, Installed ROCK on the NUC, installed Control software on Windows 10 PC, Win 10 Laptop, iPad and Android phone, and RoPieee on the Pi…
Plugged it in, and it all worked first time, all using the existing, excellent documentation having first done a little research and planning.
Splitting the Alll-in-One installer would help newcomers to understand easier the Windows 10 environment.
If something is worth having, it is worth a little work to understand it - all the info is there, just needs a little effort.
I completely agree. However… Roon can’t (shouldn’t) assume ->any<- of their customers or potential customers are familiar with Linux, command prompts or even having to navigate through the “excellent” documentation. I’d say the greatest hurdle Roon has going forward is educating that potential customer how quickly and easily Roon can be configured and running.
I’m working with a 7th friend to explain how Roon is beneficial, and if I need to, I will configure a Pi for them and mail it to Canada. But left to his own, he wouldn’t ever consider Roon. The average audiophile simply can’t understand it.
In order to get Roon to a million+ users, they need to re-think their approach.
Fair point, yes it should be made clearer and easier for those that do not RTFM, (I also knew, and still know, nothing about Linux). Maybe the build document could be re-written to make it clearer that These are the options and components, and This is how they work, and to follow These steps sequentially to install and configure the various components.
This is how the install documentation actual does work (well it did for me), but it is not clear that you do This which is the link to the step and actions to take, and then return back to the previous point and continue for the next step (and repeat until all steps completed).
It’s like most things these days. Everything has it’s own vocabulary and instructions are written by a technnical person who totally understands and uses that vocabulary. If a user just wants to listen to high definition music and doesn’t know a client from a core and a bit from a bite, they can be totally lost. I know nothing about Linux and don’t want to learn. I ran into this same problem with building Raspberry Pi based ADS-B devices for flying. People kept saying to simply do this and do that in Linux. What? It doesn’t help with they use acronyms and letters if you don’t know what the hell they mean.
It would also solve the issue of installations where a core was converted to client use, but, still shows up intermittently in the list of Servers, when that pc is on and Roon is running; which has caused some confusion in my house. I have had the discussion so many times about why this is so, but, my spouse still just stares at me with a blank face and doesn’t get it.
I also have had that discussion about the dual nature of the software install with pretty much everyone I’ve introduced to Roon. Some like it and some really do not and find it super-confusing.
Cough - guilty as charged. I do this a lot. I’ve always assumed that a device running the Roon Control component (i.e. the user interface) is a “Remote” - thinking about the combination of hardware and software as a whole, and viewing it as the “remote control” for the Roon environment.
In my defence, I note that this KB article on licenses does the same, lumping all the control devices into “Roon Remotes”:
Unlimited Roon Remotes (Windows PC’s, Macs, Android devices, Apple iPads and iPhones)
Install Roon on any supported devices you want to use as a remote, including Macs or Windows computers, Android tablets or phones, or iPhones or iPads.
Indeed it might be less confusing if the All-in-one Roon packages were spilt into Roon Server and Roon Remote bundles…
I really don’t see the problem. You install Roon on windows, it asks you do you want to run as a core or as a controller. Choose which you want job done. I did this from the off after reading the kb. I admit the kB needs some love but this is pretty simple to grasp. Please let’s not have seperate apps.
a reasonable (and growing) percent of our new users now do not run on windows/mac/linux. they come out of the gate running servers on dedicated hardware (Nucleus mostly, but also ROCK and third party Roon Cores)
We’ve been trying to figure out how to explain the download/getting started with Roon to everyone. It is not easy. This plan makes it much easier.
grab Roon Server and run it where your music/audio is, or on a dedicated appliance machine like X, Y, Z
grab Roon Remote and run it where you want to interact with Roon
grab Roon Bridge if you want to extend Roon’s audio capabilities elsewhere
grab ROCK or buy a Nucleus if you are ready to transition from mac/windows/linux for the Roon Server to a reliable always-ready Roon appliance.
There’s a Roon Remote app for iOS and Android. Why not compile two more… one labeled “Roon Remote for Windows” and one labeled “Roon Remote for Macintosh”, neither of which gives the ability to install Core.
Next, clarify the difference between “Roon”, “Roon Server” and “Rock”.
Renaming “Roon” as “Roon Core” (still headless or not) would help tremendously.
I realize this suggestion will come with some… disagreement, which is expected.