But since $99 includes those already, the isolated DAC shouldn’t add more than that, should it?
Yes you can buy many expensive DACs that probably offer good isolation however mine doesn’t as it sounds rubbish connected directly to a PC.
Would you be too offended if I said that a DAC that sounds rubbish is rubbish and doesn’t deserve isolators and streamers?
1 Like
Not offended at all roon recommends using a streamer for a reason and if for some reason you cannot hear the difference so I guess you must be in the wrong forum.
Do they also recommend isolators?
1 Like
If you subscribe to Roon, you are in the right forum! 
- I believe you are thinking of Audigon or “Best Of”…
Or if you are a former subscriber, like me.
Roon can’t guarantee that all DACs will be competently designed and therefore immune to noise/ground loops or other spuriae when connected directly to a Nucleus via USB.
Hence, the recommendation is to use a streamer between the Core and the DAC. It’s not that adding a streamer guarantees a better sonic performance, it’s that adding a streamer prevents a rubbish DAC from screwing things up.
If you have a competently designed DAC there will be no difference to hear, whether direct USB attached to the Core, or connected via a streamer.
This stuff isn’t rocket surgery, just basic electrical/electronic engineering.
9 Likes
PS audio also recommend using a streamer https://www.psaudio.com/blogs/copper/roon-done-right-a-user-guide?srsltid=AfmBOoroKSwTSpZAd2q1-08bRrF2GAEzMKENlzL52kfZURg8XyqbGldQ
1 Like
Yes, and for the same reasons that Roon does.
You don’t have to use a streamer if you have a competently designed DAC whose performance isn’t hampered by by being connected to a computer via USB.
In your case, you find an improvement - that indicates a lack of isolation on your DAC’s USB input.
1 Like
Roon do not recommend a separate streamer.
They recommend separation between server and output devices. One example they give is using a Raspberry Pi, connected via USB to a DAC.
You can also get there by using Roon Bridge–our lightweight endpoint package. Combine that thing with a Raspberry Pi or Cubox and an audiophile-grade power supply and you have a great little network bridge to use with your existing USB DAC.
The origins of Roon’s recommendation lies in the days of noisy server PCs. Obviously this impacts on SQ if you’re using your server as an output device.
On many occasions Roon staff have refused to be drawn into any further comment on SQ of different set ups.
1 Like
It’s a recommendation, not technical gospel, and purely in terms of Roon limiting their expose to endless inane questions, superstitions and support queries, probably a sensible stance for them to take as a company.
Roon’s partners get to sell another Roon Ready device, Roon have one less support issue to deal with, it’s a win-win all round.
Look at it this way, if someone stops me in the street and asks me how to get from A to B I’ll give them one route that I know will get them there with minimal risk of getting lost, even if there are a dozen other, potential faster, cheaper or more scenic ways to make that journey. That doesn’t make the route I gave them the best or only route.
6 Likes
Thanks for bringing up the isolator. I wasn’t trying to solve the noise problem on the best side of the ground-chain. I have a coax connection to my dac that is not isolated.An ethernet isolator did it for me.
Some might say better sound of the lps is caused by the earth pin not being connected to the audio chain 
.
And the sub amp automatically switches off again.
1 Like
But the Pi is a streamer, isn’t it?
2 Likes
The point I was attempting to make was about alleged USB noise and why Roon recommends separating server and output (physical noise and computing performance rather than USB noise). I’ll leave it at that as I’m not really a fan of these back and forth threads.
It’s easy to isolate a S/PDIF coax connection. There are plenty of transformer-based options for doing this, heck I’ve even DIY’d this with an ethernet transformer
1 Like
I’d view the Roon Core as the streamer and the RPi as a bridge between the streamer and DAC.
OH - well technically you are right - it is the Roon server the one doing the streaming!
Colloquially, though, we call streamer a device that is a combo of a DAC and a computing device that will act as a host to the DAC and receive as an input an audio network stream, for which there are different standards - for Roon Ready devices, they run the roon bridge I assume.
With that I mind, I will say that a lot of the commercially available streamers, including very high end, expensive ones are basically Raspberry PIs with a DAC and of course the proprietary software that makes them unique. I am not knocking them, of course, all I am saying is that with a little knowledge most setups you can do will get you something that is audibly indistinguishable from the expensive stuff!
2 Likes
-
So they can sell you another box. And it just shows how gullible some are buying a $10k DAC and accepting that it can be greatly improved with an optional psu
-
Which begs the question: why not design it with a LPS in the first place? See above…
1 Like
I think the point is that, in this example, Chord don’t sell optional PSUs. Indeed, their designer says that you should stick with the one provided.
2 Likes