Hello there
I must be hallucinating but since a while now, I feel that volume leveling is making the music flat. I can’t hear much bass and the sound seems lower. Did something change?
I selected Auto and tried different modes, still feels flat.
It’s on -14LUFS, what does that mean? And why can’t I put -5 to have leveling but still audible?
Hi @Gigatoaster
Just a fellow Roon user here.
This article is quite informative but refers to Spotify. However it should help you understand it.
Some say that levelling the loudness should affect audio dynamics but some say it doesn’t.
I tend not to use loudness level at all. I listen to it as it is.
Your drugs maybe?
Okay, just kidding… nothing’s been changed!
It makes perfect sense to use volume leveling to adjust individual title’s absolute levels in order for the median loudness to stay around a set target level to prevent perceived loudness jumps between songs.
Roon’s nomenclature sticks with the E(uropean)B(roadcast)U(nion) standard for their average dynamic range display and L(oudness)U(nits)F(ull)S(cale) target, that’s been introduced to standardize radio programme mixing.
Of course, in most cases the effect is that the music sounds “lower”, since their level need be lowered for above reasons.
If it’s too low a volume for you, just twist your knob up to liking.
It does not affect dynamics, since it’s just a fixed level offset per song or album.
In Roon volume calculations are done with 64 bit precision, correlating to a dynamic range of 384dB.
So no worries, any artifact introduced is many orders of magnitude below what any amp or human perception may be able to resolve.
That’s interesting, although I have difficulties to understand the difference between loudness and sound dynamics and how they are linked.
Not only leveling makes the sound feel “turned down”, I feel it makes the music flat.
Now if I turned it off, some songs are pretty loud and if you don’t use it Menzies, do you play all the time with the knob?
I might try Marin’s suggestion. For some reason my amp is always at 45m it’s a Rotel A14 MKII and when it got it first it was at 45. I had another Rotel and it was also at 45. I wonder if there is a reason.
Yes, volume levelling does lower the volume (dB) of the track/album. With Roon set to auto level, the LUFS level by default is -14LUFS. This lowers all tracks perceived volume to the same level. It shouldn’t in theory alter the dynamics of the track. If it’s LUFS isn’t known you can set a default -dB to lower all tracks by. This is preset to -5dB.
You say the music appears flat. This is the dynamics I refer to. Some may refer to it differently.
I personally don’t use auto levelling or levelling at all.
Not at all. I allow the music to flow as intended and only occasionally touch my knob!
With the info I posted you’ll have an idea of what LUFS is, what volume levelling does and also what it’s not meant to do.
There are a number of threads here, and on other services discussing volume levelling and the loudness wars.
A bad analogy is driving on a road. I like the undulation of the hills, up and down. If all roads were levelled off, they’d be flat. So, volume levelling is designed to stop this by putting camber to the road.
Terrible analogy but it might help.
Some people describe what you’ve written, sounding flat, less dynamic.
I trust me ears and set my sound how I like it.
Enjoy the music.
Same for me. It depends on your music sources if you have to change the volume often.
I also don’t use leveling, however that’s because I think that leveling is track oriented and I’m an album listener. And I don’t mind adjusting volume frequently.
My assumption is that volume leveling is just that: adjusting the volume so the peak matches some value (perhaps more clever, but still just a volume adjustment). There is no compression applied. Am I correct? If so, it should have no effect on fidelity.
It’s only track oriented if you set it to “track”. If you set it to “album”, it levels whole albums and does not change the volume relationships of tracks within an album. If you set it to “auto”, it uses track levels in playlists and album levels in albums
Of course you are correct.
You’re right. It’s an appalling analogy… 
Guys, I really don’t know but I turned off Volume Leveling and been listening to music for 1h now, but not only the sound is louder but I can feel more emotion, more stage and whatever audiophile guru words you guys usually use. But it’s loud, though.
One exemple, with Walking Backwards Through the Cosmic Mirror from Shpongle, at some point there’s like a 3D effect of the music like a sound spiralling in front of you (5:15 to 5:30).
Another song, L’Enfer from Stromae, it’s more sad and gives more goosebumps when playing without Volume Leveling.
Now play song with leveling and turn it up…
That’s what louder does to our hearing.
This whole discussion would only make sense if volume was adjusted precisely to the same level, with and without leveling. (And 0.1 dB off may not be noticed as a volume difference but has an impact on perception. So it does need to be precise)
That’s the problem… psychoacoustic testing says louder is always perceived as ‘better’. If you’re trying to determine whether volume levelling in Roon is reducing sound quality, you have to match levels some other way (like using the volume knob… ) to within less than 1dB.
That’s not to say levelling using the EBU algorithm will always give you the level you would have chosen yourself as ‘best’ for any specific track/album/whatever. But it might mean you aren’t constantly reaching for the remote…
Great. So I’ll just play with my knob. Thanks everyone for your help!
In doing so, I think, will give you great pleasure overall. Enjoy. 
Playing with your knob in the privacy of your own home is fine. However, I would suggest volume leveling when in public.
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