ARC crashing daily, disconnect/recover temporarily fixes (ref#X99RPX)

Hi! What’s not quite right with Roon?

· Can’t reach my Server, remotes or ARC

Can’t connect to my Server, remotes or ARC

· Other ARC issues

Tell us what's going on

· Arc frequently crashing - disconnecting and reconnecting from the server seems to fix, but only temporarily

This is happening every day, at least, and has been the case for several weeks now. It happened once again today, and I resolved it, once again, by disconnecting/reconnecting around 12:00 GMT.

Do the logs show a consistent cause of Arc crashes at Roon’s end?

Might this be a large library issue?

Tell us about your home network

· Zyxel three hub in bridge mode passing through to google WiFi mesh

In case it’s relevant to this issue whenever I go into the info tab for an album in Arc the ‘blue flash’ keeps sweeping without stopping until I leave the tab.

Hi @Greg_Ince,

Thanks for reaching out. We’ve reviewed the diagnostics report from your devices and it appears that the crashes are likely due to an out-of-memory issue, as your library is quite large and your phone has only 4 GB of RAM.

We’ve escalated this case to our developers for further review, and they will look into possible optimizations. In the meantime, please consider disabling smart downloads to improve stability.

If that doesn’t help, you might want to try using Tailscale VPN for a better connection with your Roon Server. You can find more details about the Tailscale setup here: Tailscale setup instructions.

Let us know how it goes.

Thanks.

OK, thanks @alex_h

This problem has started to become a repeating matter in recent weeks, so a change in experience in general terms for me.

That said, it may not be the first time the matter has arisen, though, as I’ve hit the same situation in the past, and thinking back, it’s often when I’ve had lots of downloads/smart downloads. It sounds like I might want to avoid downloads to the hardware limitations of my iPhone being pegged at 4GB of RAM.

When I have disconnected/reconnected to the server or deleted+rebooted+added the app back in the last few weeks, instead of re-configuring ARC to my liking, including using smart downloads. I’ve experimented with simply accepting the defaults, but the issue still arises nonetheless.

When I do reconnect, because I suspected a large library might be a strain, I’ve have also taken to keeping the phone display from going to sleep, and placing it on charge in order to give ARC enough time to sync for the first time.

Another thought here is that I did migrate my library from an internal drive to an external drive recently - might this have created some library bloat somehow? The timelines of this change and emergence of this issue becoming consistent and repeating each day might intersect here.

As a side note, I am also experiencing the issues others are having relating to Qobuz at the moment, too: playback of particular tracks being impossible, along with a flurry of albums being added again/afresh. I mention this in case there’s a connection, given my experiences of these issues has also emerged in the last week or two, too.

Thanks for the tip re. tailscale. I’ll investigate that, but as this is a change in experience that has emerged very recently, I would also like to establish what’s causing this as its a quite frustrating shift.

Hi @alex_h

Whilst I’ve not had a chance to try out tailscale, I can report another shut down this morning around 8:30 this morning. I managed to disconnect and reconnect to the server whilst out of my house, over a mobile signal, and am back in again and listening.

I had no downloads of any kind, and no changes to defaults. Since disconnecting reconnecting to the server yesterday.

Any further pointers from the logs in relation to this crash event?

Hi @alex_h another day, and another shutdown around 13:00/13:30 today.

Hi @alex_h I hit another crash/shutdown event 20:47 last night - another disconnect/reconnect from the server, followed by keeping the iPhone plugged in with its screen on (but brightness down) for the first sync fixed things once more, and without generating too much heat from the device.

Things seem ok as of this morning. Will see how long it functions for today.

Do these recent crashes still point to an out off memory issue?

Also, out of interest what amount of iPhone RAM would you expect to minimise such an issue occurring?

@alex_h

Another crash upon attempted use around 12:00 midday today.

Disconnect/reconnect/sync fixed it once again.

I hope these times stamps and updates are helpful. No chance to try tailscale yet.

Hi @Greg_Ince,

Thanks for the follow-up! We’re still seeing some memory related failures, did you test out skipping all downloads when attempting to sync/use Arc?

With that, we also see Arc logs mention “Black Rider”-u12. It looks like it is specifically choking while trying to stream or download the track “Black Rider” (possibly the Bob Dylan song or another track with that name in your library).

It looks like Arc is retrying the download at an incredibly aggressive pace. This could be spamming retries without a cooldown, rapidly overloading the app’s memory and processing threads, which is almost certainly what is causing the app to freeze or crash entirely.

If you remove the problematic file above, and perform a fresh install of Arc, do you see the same issues?

Thanks, @benjamin - I had stopped using downloads/amending defaults.

I did download one album late last night though (The Orb - Blue Room), but I didn’t have download of any albums linked with a ‘Black Rider’ file, with the Dylan one being an example that comes to mind as being a likely candidate.

I’ve have cleared download from last night this morning, disconnected from the server, logged out of arc, deleted it, reinstalled it. Meanwhile, I have restarted the server twice, ahead of rebooting the machine the server runs on after that.

Following that, I have signed back in to arc, and synced again. It would be interesting to know if there’s a sign of the Black Rider problem appearing again.

I wasn’t sure if you meant remove potential Black Rider files from my library completely, so didn’t do that as well - I can though if that’s what you meant. It’s also possible that file was a Qobuz file, as my preferred version of the Dylan album the track is on is a Qobuz one.

Hey @Greg_Ince,

We’re not seeing any of the same error traces we saw previously, which is good news!

Are you having the same issues?

Hi @benjamin it’s just happened once again. About 24 hours on from the last disconnect/reconnect routine 8:57 ish. I’ll run the disconnect reconnect drill once again, but this is still happening every day.

Hi @benjamin

Another crash event this morning around 8:30am.

I’ve just disconnected/reconnected again to get back up and running. I was wondering there might have been an improvement, as I think that this has been a longer period in-between events than it’s has typically been in recent weeks, but my ARC usage will have dropped off over the holiday weekend here in the UK.

Hi @benjamin another one this morning - around 10:30 am. I’ve run through the steps of disconnecting/reconnecting once again. I wonder what you’ve seen in the logs - I’m not able to go through a server reboot every time this happens, as I am often away from home, and this is the quickest way to recover access thus far.

I do note something strange in the ‘added’ section though - Big Thief’s Double Infinity - an album via Qobuz - that appears first in the list. I noticed that at the point of crash, and prior to the disconnect / reconnect it indicated something like being added 305 or 306 days ago. Following the sync, it now says added today, but I hadn’t done this, but I do know my mentioned yesterday evening that she had been listening to this, and had done so via the Qobuz app - she also listened to it this morning, before I tried to use ARC.

I wonder if this is a tell that there’s a Qobuz knock on in the mix here that’s leading to my experience somehow?

Hi @benjamin another crash around 8:20am this morning and the same on my second attempt at 9:07 am

Hey @Greg_Ince,

Thanks for the reply! Our Arc development team was able to take a closer look into your case, and came to the same conclusion you’ve mentioned in your first post : the core of your issue here is indeed your library size.

Our team is only able to test and fully confirm proper functionality within library sizes of up to 100k tracks. Anything over that should work, but it’s not something we’re able to officially confirm.

Moving forward, a good next step would be to create a new database with ~50% fewer tracks overall. This would also likely help with the make and model iOS device you’re attempting to use Arc with as well.

I realize this is less than ideal, you have my apologies there Greg, let us know if this is something you’d consider trying!

OK @benjamin, that’s helpful. Thanks.

The situation has continued here and remains pretty consistent. I’ve been away from home for a few days, and the disconnect/reconnect rhythm each day has continued to be required to get back up and running as and when crashing begins.

I have also noticed certain settings create labour in ARC, with iPhone heat up here and there, too - sorting, for example, has also lead to crashing - album lists being a good example.

I’m still wondering what may have changed (besides Qobuz related issues), as this is quite a ‘new’ problem, after what has largely been plain sailing for a long time.

I’m not against the idea of creating a new db - that makes sense to try. I’ve tended to curate - and expand my library - around my local files by adding a lot of Qobuz albums over time. I think about half of my library is made up of paths to qobuz content as a result, and I suppose this possibly means that I have a large library as a result, and one that is using Qobuz heavily, as well.

The only thing I can think of that points to a big change, is that I migrated my local library from my internal HDD on my iMac to an external HD wired to my iMac, roughly at the same time that the qobuz issues arose, and therefore at the time this started to happen. Might there be library bloat or historic file paths clogging my library up? I think I followed the Roon guidance re. moving my local files, but maybe there’s some kind of clean up needed?

As for a new db, I’m guessing that the easiest option might be to remove the qobuz content from the library completely, and from thereon take a different approach to adding qobuz content?

Thanks,

Greg

@benjamin Quick one to say I cleared my listen later queue on whim a couple of days ago, as it occurred to me there was Qobuz content in that list - since then I’ve not experienced a crash… Will monitor and update. Would be interesting see if anything appears changed at your end?

Hi @benjamin I experienced my first crash > disconnect > reconnect for a few days here around 10:00am this morning. The UI locked up and then crashed. I wonder what you can see in the logs about the event - given things have been stable for a while it seems like something changed or happened that hadn’t been happening.