The other solution involved some changes to our services. Can you please test again? (no reset needed)
Very big boxes are sluggish to navigate in the Remote or the Windows GUI as a rough unscientific stab i would say less than 50 Discs are OK getting worse as you get bigger.
Mozart 255 is not good but is 200 CDs
Many big boxes are in smaller volumes eg Karajan DG
EDIT: I jut tried Mozart 225 (200 CD) and it does appear quite snappy , Focus on an Artist = Willi Boskovsky is almost instant. That seems better than I remember but accent on remember
I have retested
Alfred Brendel works after a fashion, it was also quite slow 12 sec
The Albums section shows after expansion 70 albums a mix of local and Tidal but seems biased to local (TBC) eg the early recordings are missing eg Schubert analogue
It includes the 114 Box. but misses the Turnabout 33 disc set.
It shows a Composition which is spurious but that could be dodgy metadata
Going via the âartist iconâ and then Discography I see Main Albums 233 so still a major mismatch
The Beethoven Sonata set (analogue) 10 discs is missing , the digital one is there .
It also doesnât seem to be isolating Brendel in comma separated multi artist sets , the albums shown in the Walter Klein set top row middle are missing from Brendel overall. Also the reversed name is separated out Brendel Alfred
I will test other artists if that helps , but for the time being the search still produces an incomplete discography
Just out of curiosity, would you like Roon to handle each disc as a separate âalbumâ, but still âgroupedâ under a box set moniker?
Or would you rather the box set was treated as a giant album of several dozen discs?
My wish is definently for the first option, which i would wager should also solve the problems discussed above.
But then, i donât own any of these humongous classical box sets, just the Maria Callas Remastered of 42 âdiscsâ⊠And a few others, with less content.
Doesnât this break down into the much needed improved handling of box sets?
This issue was caused by running older .NET Framework on older Windows version that canât be upgraded to version 4.8. This problem has similar root cause to previous critical issues with no function available in older .NET Framework version as below.
12/10 01:38:33 Critical: [search] error performing instant search: System.MissingMethodException: Method not found: 'System.Collections.Generic.HashSet`1<!!0> System.Linq.Enumerable.ToHashSet(System.Collections.Generic.IEnumerable`1<!!0>)'.
at Sooloos.Broker.Music.SearchApiConverter.BuildApiSearchRequest(LibrarySearchResults librarySearchResults, List`1 playlists, List`1 tags, Library library)
at Sooloos.Broker.Music.LibraryApi.<RunInstantSearch>d__6.MoveNext()
--- End of stack trace from previous location where exception was thrown ---
at System.Runtime.CompilerServices.TaskAwaiter.ThrowForNonSuccess(Task task)
at System.Runtime.CompilerServices.TaskAwaiter.HandleNonSuccessAndDebuggerNotification(Task task)
at Sooloos.Broker.Music.LibraryApi.<>c__DisplayClass5_0.<<Sooloos-Broker-Api-Library-UnifiedAutocomplete>b__0>d.MoveNext()
I hope next update they will address this issue and resolve Roon Search being broken with workaround solutions from using different implementations for older .NET framework version.
@WindowsX thank you for the help. The issue youâre mentioning has been fixed for the upcoming release. However, the one that weâre talking about in this thread has nothing to do with it.
I see. Iâm glad to hear this issue will be resolved in upcoming release. I hope itâll be out in next few days. And yeah no results is another issue to be addressed and I hope you will resolve this soon.
Hi @zenit,
Just a quick response so you have some feedback. I will look more closely later.
In general there is a vast improvement in search, so thanks for that. But subjectively roon responsiveness has taken a hit, so all interactions (not just search) feel slower. Search itself is quick to respond with, for example an artist, but the discographies of major artists are very sluggish to populate. A search on Barenboim for example is still populating album covers 45 minutes later. Maybe there is some kind of caching mechanism and that will gradually improve?
Please also bear in mind I have a Qobuz account so for major artists the album counts are going to be very high.
Herbert von Karajan
âKarajanâ still returns zero results as does âvon Karajanâ, but âHerbert von Karajanâ returns sensible results. Also, as with Richard Bonygne I had to try the search 2 or 3 times before I got any results at all. Once the drop down in the search box is populated then search consistently returns results.
The only thing is the top result is an album rather than the artist which is surprising:
When I click on Hebert von Karajan the artist then the initial pages are quicker to load than Barenboim but the discography is over 850 albums (including Qobuz) and that populates about the same speed as the Barenboim (425 albums)
Daniel Barenboim
Returns sensible results but very sluggish (425 albums)
A general comment. There are a lot of âcompositeâ artists being returned where artist list delimiters are not being handled properly:
Karl Böhm
Returns sensible results but very sluggish (278 albums)
Alfred Brendel
Returns sensible results but very sluggish (225 albums)
Richard Bonynge
Sensible results but again very sluggish. Also I had to try the search 2 or 3 times before I got any results at all. Once the drop down in the search box is populated then search consistently returns results.
Benjamin Britten
Very sluggish but more sensible results with core repertoire being shown upfront. I do not know why major Benjamin Britten box sets are pushed down out of visibility into the âCompilationâ section where they are mixed up with generic non-composer specific box sets like â50 Greatest British Classicsâ or various generic, non-composer specific Decca compilations.
Miles Davis
Returns sensible results but very sluggish (419 albums)
Bill Evans
Returns sensible results but very sluggish (233 albums)
Just to be perverse â ALL 3 !
Not all box sets are born equal. Your first option as a box as a collection of albums would be first prize but not all boxes split so logically . Permit me 3 examples
-
One Extreme Glenn Gould Original Jackets - splits perfectly with each disc containing a previously released CD
-
Other Extreme Mozart 255 is a random mix of artists, the works are relatively logical but the artists are selected from Universalâs complete stable (Decca, DG,Philips etc) The older complete Mozart 1989 was a collection of previously released box sets so Eg Piano Sonatas by Uchida, the new one (255) contains all the sonatas but by several artists. So option 1) could never win
-
Somewhere between the 2 extremes
. More often than not. Also many big boxes contain previously released bac catalogue vinyl, so 45 mins, packed out to 70 mins for CD so a match is not possible to a previous release ( and a half)
Box sets will come with some artwork, say a CD sleeve with track details, not necessarily an Album Cover as such since often itâs not a recognised album.
The best compromise is to maintain the Album Name for the whole box and to allow a Disc Name for each CD. Each CD being allowed itâs own Artwork. The whole box having a Composite Box Cover as you would buy
Yes itâs a mess ⊠I manage it in JRiver by creating custom tags for Box Set, Disc and Disc Volume (where a big box is split into a collection of smaller boxes like Symphony, Concerto etc) but even then I can set the disc artwork but not a box artwork.
In code terms a box would have to be a completely separate object and not even a collection of Albums although the individual Disc with share many properties with an album but specifically one to one
Clear as Mud ??? Perhaps I should write the coding spec 
1 Like
Yes, all understandable and reasonable. I agree with your stance that thereâs no easy, single answer to fullfill all needs and scenarios.
Thanks for elaborating! 
1 Like
I tend to agree with Mike. This is the best compromise. So after all these years it is possible to specify precisely a non controversial box-set solution.
I wouldnât jump through hoops splitting large box sets into individual CDâs if I was just able to browse a box set visually using the individual CD artwork. At the end of the day it is quite rare, especially with large Classical box sets, that they split exactly into âidentifiableâ original jackets CDâs.
It may also be the case that as functionality is being migrated from the core to the cloud that this is the perfect opportunity to address long-standing bug-bears like box-set handling.
1 Like
If you check Tidal, not sure about Qobuz, the 225 box is shown as a collection of sub sets. Complete Concertos, Complete Trios etc
I will have a play importing these sub sets and see if they ID, they look small counts eg Symphony set is 14 CD . May fix that one.
Even the monster Karajan set is in 9 chunks
If real mega boxes is the stumbling block it may be a viable workaround. That would leave my biggest set at 114
I have had most of the 225âs as Qobuz subsets for quite a while. At the moment they are mixed up with the 180 subsets. I could probably tidy that up. They do id and of course in bite sized chunks they are much easier to navigate.
We moved pretty much permanently out of town during Covid and I just left all my NAS storage behind. I had a much smaller library on my laptop and started filling in in gaps I wanted to play from Qobuz. So I only really noticed this search issue when we returned to town on a permanent basis a few weeks ago after more than 2 years and I fired up my old NAS storage. So the 225 is actually a duplicate and I have removed it.
Itâs been quite an eye opener. Fingers crossed that everything that roon are planning to migrate from core to cloud will work even in edge cases like ours.
To be honest, if it was feasible I would migrate completely to streamed services. The main issue is that because of constantly changing licensing agreements, content is unpredictably pulled by the streaming operators causing roon to fail with âunavailable contentâ. Nine times out of ten there is an alternative release but it is a manual process to replace it in your roon library and you only really notice it after the event. If for example you have a queue of albums and one of them is unavailable roon will halt play entirely as it will âfailâ after 4 track play attempts.
I do not know the details but I believe that Qobuz has a way of grouping releases so that when one is pulled, it is flagged, and a more elegant fail over to an âavailableâ release, than just halting play entirely, is technically possible. Increasingly, I think that sort of deeper integration with the streaming operators will become very important.
Hi
You specifically singled out Mozart 225 as a problem , its a 200 CD box , probably the biggest I know of. DG/Decca split it into 28 x bite size chunks as digital downloads, the biggest being 17 CD, I have removed my 200 CD box , and split it into the equivalent 28 Digital downloads . Maybe if you can log my search activity on my core you may get some hints.
The Symphony box is now 12 CD, If I type âhaffâ (for Haffner Symphony 35) its still sluggish. 10 CD boxes are literally 10 a penny . Beethoven Piano Sonatas sets are 10 CD typically
I think my biggest box is now around 120 CD.
Just a few observations , Focus by Composition is quick , its when you start to apply the Filter in the main album view to get to a specific work that things slow down badly. My guess is that every letter triggers a new search so typing âoboeâ with search for anything âoâ , then âobâ . Is it not possible to wait for a Return to start the search once the complete word has been typed. Not as slick but surely that would reduce the search load massively . Piano would be one search rather than 5 even if the next letter terminates the previous search it would help.
I have used Roon for over 6 yeas now and I have never had the nasty âNot Respondingâ error until just recently . This morning I had to literally intervene through Task Manager to kill the process - NOT good
Just as an example typing âadieuxâ in a filter on a 117 CD box took 30 seconds for the word to appear and another 30 seconds to return a result . In fact I typed it wrong so it was a blank. Trying to backspace to correct the type
I am happy to help if you want a âtesterâ on my system the whole Search / Filter on box sets / Albums is virtually unusable certainly unacceptably slow by comparison to before the change. This is even on 10 CD boxes which as I say are extremely common in the classical world
1 Like
Interesting observation. I wounder if there are other things now stressing cloud servers that used to be done in all our cores?
Just try typing a word into filter on an album.
The keyboard buffer takes the keystrokes but the actual word takes an age to appear. Typoâs are easy because you donât get to see the word for many seconds , in my case 30 seconds for âadieuxâ to appear. The search restarts at each letter (I think)
Try âoboeâ, if you look at the album every âoâ is highlighted in orange !!, so each vowel is a nightmare , its only when the string gets more specific that the search is worth while . It doesnât really show on a single album but expand that to even a 10 CD set and it grinds to a halt let alone 200 CD. No wonder Mozart 225 is a problem.
Plenty âoâ: and of limited value
Not Many âobâ
Even Less âoboâ
The âby letterâ design is bound to overload search resources. Maybe start at 3 letters or when Return is hit would minimize the number of (unwanted) searches.
Yes, I can reproduce this. It doesnât even have to be a Classical box. Any old box will do.
I have just realised I can use focus/inspector on the number of CDâs in a box. I had no idea what to use that for but I have set it to filter on all albums with 10+ CDs. I see now it is ideal for testing roon Cloud performance. Itâs also ideal for finding which boxâs I never got around to splitting. Iâd like to go about it more systmatically though and split boxâs where roon has determined that they are effecting performance.
This Jazz one from ECM has just 12CDs so I just tried a letter by letter test on Paul Motion and I see exactly the effect you describe with âoboeâ. The lags are noticeable but it is borderline tolerable.
Of course the bigger the box, the bigger the effect. By the time I get to 55CDs, the filter is essentially unusable. With this box set I did a letter by letter search on Clarinet trying to get to the famous Mozart clarinet concerto (Out of Africa). I got there in the end but absolutely painful as along the way roon was doing so many redundant searches on Claudio Abbadoâs back-catalogue
That tends to be the standard way of avoiding these issues. 
I always knew I was clever
2 Likes