2019 IMAC I5 3.7 GHZ INTEL 6-CORE 24 GB RAM
EERO mesh wifi - 5 pods
Multiple endpoints. Bryston BDP-2 (2) ethernet, microrendu ethernet, ipad wireless .
12000 tracks
Frequent crashes. Usually within five minutes of startup. Basically makes the program unusable.
I have removed Surfshark VPN, added Roon to the firewall exceptions, and have deleted and reinstalled the program.
@rrwwss52, what version of MacOS are you using? I have a 2019 MBPro running Ventura 13.3 and donāt have any issues running as a Core or Remote.
Is it the Mac Core itself crashing, or the iPad Remote?
Hi @Robert_F
Ventura 13.3. The imac desktop is crashing on a regular basis.
I dropped my logs into the Roon system.
First time Iāve used it so hopefully it arrives intact.
rrwwss52_logs.zip
Hello, can you confirm #support has received my logs. I continue to have frequent crashes.
Can you help? Havenāt received any support responses or acknowledgement in several days.
Hi @rrwwss52,
Thank you for your patience and please accept our apologies for the delay. The team has examined logs and we have a few follow-up questions and steps to try.
Does any hanging or freezing in the UI precede the crash?
Are you on any particular page when you experience this crash? (ie. search, Albums).
Do you experience the crash during playback, or is it independent of playback?
Are you by chance using Time Machine to back up a local storage location (or Backup location) in use by Roon?
Letās try to refresh your database, as well:
While likely not responsible for the crash, logs also indicate that there might be an issue with mDNS on this network, affecting both network endpoints and remotes. If you havenāt already, please verify that both multicast and IGMP snooping are enabled across your network.
Do you have a router upstream of the mesh system?
Weāll be on the lookout for your response. Thank you!
Hi Connor. Thanks for getting back to me. I did the database refresh already with the Roon old file. Problem /crashes continued.
#1. Database crashes on its own. No other known issues with the imac, but something must be triggering it.
#2 no particular page. Just crashes. Sometimes in five minutes, sometimes it will go longer.
#3. Roon UI crashes during playback AND music analysis when reloading the problem, even when the program is not playing music.
#4 Time Machine is only activated manually.
Yes on a Spectrum modem upstream from the mesh system. No other router though.
Not sure what the mDNS biz is. Can you guide me on that. Iāll check my messages tonite when I get home from work. Thanks again.
Iāll try the database refresh again as well.
Edit: can you also explain how to enable multicast and igmp Snooping. My mesh wifi is Eero. Thanks
Roon database saved as Roon_old2
Reloaded.
Program froze while analyzing tracks. restarted and was able to get the full catalog analyzed.
Reached out to eero support on the phone. Their devices do not support IGMP at this timeā¦it has never been an issue for me in the past. Iāve had eero mesh routers for several years.
Iām running two zones. One as the imac, and the second is an endpoint, The NAIM endpoint stopped, and the imac kept playing, but the program didnāt crash. I restarted the NAIM, and weāll see what happens.
Hi @rrwwss52,
Thank you for your quick response - weāll aim to do the same here and get you back to your music as soon as possible.
Iām pulling diagnostics from your Core again to see if the database refresh changed any of the storage mounting issues present before and if there are any giveaway traces related to why the audio analysis is failing.
We should have follow-up steps within a few hours. Please stand by and thank you for your patience once again.
Hi Connor, the good news is I have had two zones running for several hours straight.
Iām hopefulā¦.maybe I just needed that database refresh. Maybe the first one didnāt take. Iām inclined not to reinstall the old one either.
I did have another instance where it ran for a day, and that went back to crashingā¦.fingers crossedā¦
Hi @rrwwss52,
Thank you for the update. The tech support team is syncing with development today and weāll investigate diagnostics from both before and after the server refresh to compare. That should give us a fruitful next step to help prevent these symptoms from recurring. Iāll post here as soon as I have additional details.
Iām definitely going to be happy about getting it back on track. Also planning to add a Nucleus to my setup. Danny suggested I get all the bugs worked on the imac before proceeding with the Nucleus install.
Bryston BDP-2 and Naim Uniti Atom endpoints still rolling as of 2:30 am Los Angeles time. Thatās good news.
Thank you again for all your help and the updates. Much appreciated. Cheersā¦Bob
Roon program crashed at 6:15 pm LA time.
I resubmitted fresh logs rrwwss52#3
Thanks. Bob
and additional logs this morningā¦rrwwss52#4
Hi @rrwwss52,
Around that timestamp and just preceding what appears to be a fully unmanaged crash, there were traces related to both the UI component of Roon on the Mac. Our investigation yesterday revealed that the Core is also struggling to mount location storage on a Western Digital external USB drive.
While itās doubtlessly frustrating to experience, the good news is it does give us the bite we needed to help isolate (and hopefully eliminate) whatās going wrong here.
Iām going to pass along three next steps to stabilize this system.
Watched Folder settings open in a dialogue box by clicking on the three dots next to your storage location and selecting āEditā from the dropdown menu.
Another thing to verify with local storage:
There are network availability errors. These are likely unrelated to the crash, but you may experience issues in the future with networked storage and endpoints. One step we recommend is to change your DNS servers in your routerās web administration page to Cloudflare DNS, Quad9 or Google DNS.
This final step is up to your discretion, as itās more heavy-handed, but itās sure to eliminate any UI-related crashing on the Core. Youāll install RoonServer in the place of Roon.
RoonServer is the āgutsā of Roon, without any of the visual or user-interfacing components. First, create a Backup and rename the current database to another āRoon_old3ā or similar. Next, download the Mac installer for RoonServer from our downloads page here: https://download.roonlabs.net/builds/RoonServer.dmg
Installing RoonServer will require you to control Roon from a Remote (iPad, etc), since the iMac will only be running Core database processes. This effectively turns your Mac into a Nucleus - itās hosting Roon and taking care of your transcoding, signal path, etc, but youāll be using an external Remote for the user interface.
Weāll be standing by to investigate the Watched Folder settings at your convenience. If you choose to install RoonServer to circumvent UI crashes, please let us know if it helps.
Iāll keep a close lookout for your response. Thank you again!
Hi @connor
1.
A Roon Backup folder was located in the Watched Folders. I deleted it. Time Machine is not in the Watched Folders file.
I downloaded Cloudfare 9 for MAC, but Iām not sure of the exact settings I should employ. Suggestions are welcome. The eero firmware doesnāt give me many options to change that in the router. There might be, but Iām not sure of them.
Would you recommend going the Roon Server route, or going with a Nucleus. Danny offered me an opportunity to purchase a demo Nucleus Plus rev A.
Is item #3 labor intensive, or a simple download?
Itās nice to have the Roon program on the desktop to feed an office DAC via USB. Can you run Nucleus and Roon simultaneously on the same license.
Thanks. Bob
Hi @rrwwss52,
Thank you for providing those screenshots. Iāll answer your questions here in-line:
BACKUP/WATCHED FOLDERS
This was more than likely causing the performance decline you experienced, and might even have underpinned the crashing. When Roon opens, it will automatically rescan the Watched Folders, and then rescan again at regular intervals. If you have any automatic Backups scheduled, then Roon would be attempting to perform Backups on a location it is actively scanning, generally slowing Roon and actually introducing corruption risks in your Backups. Youāve done the right thing here by moving the Backup location.
DNS
To change your DNS server to one of the recommended above (Quad9, Google, or Cloudflare) in the Eero web administration page, follow these steps:
DNS is heavily involved in local network device discovery, so a reliable DNS server will help improve your overall Roon network stability.
NUCLEUS, RoonServer, and Roon Remote
The Nucleus+ is a powerful computer custom-designed to host RoonServer, and we recommend it as a Core over the iMac. Since the crash youāre experiencing appears related to the UI of a Mac install of Roon āall-in-oneā (ie. RoonServer and Roon Remote combined), migrating RoonServer to the Nucleus would allow you to install Roon Remote on the iMac without any of the Core components.
Weāre also well-equipped as a team to support any issue with the Nucleus. Since itās our hardware, we have a full suite of tools to assist if any unforeseen issues arise.
Your Roon license allows for a single Core (RoonServer can only be installed in one place, either the Nucleus or the iMac). There is no limit on the number of Roon Remotes you can use with a Core, however. So, yes, you can run a Nucleus and Roon Remote on your license. The Nucleus would be your Core (RoonServer), and your iMac, iPad, any other desired compatible device would function as a Roon Remote.
If youād like to try RoonServer on your iMac in the meantime as you decide, itās a simple download. Just make sure youāve uninstalled Roon fully before installing RoonServer.
Weāre more than happy to answer any additional questions. Thank you again!
Thanks Connor.
will my Custom DNS IPv4 and 1Pv6 addresses be 1.1.1.1?
I think the Nucleus is going to be the preferred route.
Hi @rrwwss52,
Thatās correct - try adding 1.1.1.1 to the DNS IPv4 address box.
This page should have more detailed information, and Iām happy to answer any other questions:
Thanks. I just messaged Danny regarding acquiring the Nucleus Plus Rev A.
Loading up Roon Server now. Itās up and runningā¦ā¦
