They currently can’t even get bit perfect output from the iPhone with camera connector. And no exclusive mode on pc, so have to manually change sampling rate. They still have work to do just to get the basics down.
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Isn’t Amazons interest in a music service a loss leader for hardware sales ?
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I repeat here, if you can’t afford Tidal, music is not that important to you. The race to the bottom for cheap will impoverish us all. Who suffers? The music creators. Time to Man Up a bit for all of us here
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Hear, hear!
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That is such an extraordinarily arrogant statement, one only needs to glance at the curvaceous yet treacherous slopes of Mount Roon to have a deep and abiding love of music.
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That’s a silly statement. I already pay for Apple Music family, Tidal, Amazon Prime, Pandora. How many services do you need? I just want one that has high quality and ease of use. If Apple had an HD service all would be well since I’ve got Apple stuff everywhere. I’m not saying Roon isn’t great, it is, but the limited integration is their downfall, where Sonos as awful as it is, does those integrations. I’m sad to leave Roon, I enjoy it, but come on do the integrations that are needed to be successful.
I am happy to find choices in the streaming world. Take the one you like best, in my case Qobuz.
Or none at all. More services will follow which can be used within Roon. There is no Tidal cult here.
Sometimes a few fanatics loose control. But nothing serious under the sun.
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If you subscribe to Tidal, that integrates with Roon.
Then why exactly have you decided to leave Roon, if you can successfully integrate Tidal?
I have never been a big fan of Tidal, but for a long time they were the only lossless service in town. Their algorithm to suggest new content is awful, whereas Apple and Amazon seem to suggest what I might like much better. It is also annoying that they charge you in a foreign currency which makes me pay an extra dollar each month.
But with Tidal integration in Roon, it is Roon that recommends new content from Tidal (or whichever streaming service you use), and not the streaming service itself. That’s therefore not a valid objection to subscribing to Tidal, especially if you use it integrated within Roon.
They only reflect the content that’s released… Its all there on Tidal. Easy to find anything you want.
Let’s try to stay on topic guys… Many thanks.
Is there a audience of new-or-non-audiophiles who might have an interest in a cheaper high-bitrate streaming service? And cares more about cost than proper (bit-perfect) signal paths? And/or doesn’t know any better? Maybe. That’s gotta be who Amazon is banking on… In my (small sample space) experiences in my own personal life, Amazon’s announcement made some waves. Some people got interested and said “oh boy, finally, a “big player” is going to offer a more affordable lossless service”. And then, with all their interest and excitement, they started going to audiophile message boards and websites and reading about things like bitperfect (“WASAPI, etc”) connections and transports… and started talking to me about what I thought, what I knew about Amazon’s service, and what I did… and every single person, to the last one, that expressed any interest in it, cancelled after their 90 day trial (or didn’t sign up at all). One of them signed up for Qobuz after the price drop. None of them kept Amazon.
If Amazon wants audiophiles (like Roon subscribers) to switch from Tidal and Qobuz? They need to embrace Roon or some other alternative that support a bitperfect transport. Otherwise? They’re not actually competition for Tidal or Qobuz (in audiophile/Roon-subscriber circles). They’re a giant catalogue of high bitrate music with a super-closed limited ecosystem and half-baked incomplete software solution to properly play said catalogue.
This is inaccurate-or-incomplete for at least a couple of reasons:
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Different streaming services pay out at different per-play rates. And while they all may be fractions-of-a-dollar per stream, they are not all equal. When I try to google what different services are paying to artists, I get all kinds of different/inconsistent reports. But overall-and-on-average, one common thing I see over-and-over-again, regardless of source, is that Qobuz and Tidal (the services in question) tend to pay out higher-than-most others. To the tune of literally whole-pennies-per-stream (one site I saw a couple months ago reported that Qobuz was paying over 4 cents per stream; no idea if that’s accurate or not). While that might seem low (maybe it is), it is several times higher than a lot of the other “big services” pay out… and that would certainly add up, over a long period (an entire year) of time over a large number (100,000) of users either on Option A (paying out at $0.012 per stream vs $0.003 per stream). It’s literally basic math. The same number of users end up putting 4x as much money in the artists pockets in this made up example. And 4x is 4x, no matter whether it’s $100-vs-$400 or $1M vs $4M. Either which way, it’s still 4x.
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The most expensive streaming service/tier combo at least was (and maybe still is) one of the ones I have - Qobuz Sublime. And the whole point to the premium tier is to (financially) incentivize the purchasing of music. Which, as you point out, certainly supports the artist. Which I do. Via Qobuz Sublime. A streaming service tier.
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Maybe they are aiming at the Audiophile, Lossless, Cellphone and EarBud market
I watch the earphone badge of office peer pressure daily at the gym , people using really quite high end cans with a cellphone as they grunt 
Without taking a view on the wider discussion in this thread, it does seem to me that the jury is very much still out on how well ‘integration’ (or collaboration) with the big boys will play out for Sonos, judging by widely reported recent developments. (e.g. here in the NY Times and in The Verge) .
Although unconvinced if comparing Sonos and Roon, either on products/services or as businesses, has much mileage, I can imagine that being muscled out is a real concern for niche players - with or without attempts at integration. Damned if… etc. Just hoping that Roon can navigate its way through for many years to come…
The problem for Roon is an indirect one.
Both Tidal & Qobuz have a lot more to fear of being pushed to (financial) death by Amazon.
And if those 2 would cease to exist, then Roon might (/will) have a very big proposition problem.
Partnering with Amazon would therefore, in my mind, the worst thing Roon can do. It is really shooting in both feet at the same time, because it will ‘help’ killing Tidal & Qobuz.
And if you read the horror stories of Sonos with both Google & Amazon, all innovation will be killed.
My recommendation, not to Roon, but to the streaming services - Tidal, Qobuz & Deezer - is to sit together to see if you can build a businessplan together, that can withstand Spotify at the one hand, and Amazon at the other.
And maybe Roon could just be the superglue to connect it all together.
Dirk
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Good points Dirk 
I’m staying with Qobuz & Tidal at the mo’. They both work with Roon. And that’s all that matters to me.
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When and if Amazon ever integrates with Roon, I will take another look at it. Otherwise, Amazon is of no interest to me. I also have free Apple Music provided by Verizon and free Spotify provided by Bose and never use either of them. Why would I since I pay for Tidal and Qobuz?
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