Roon Ready DAP?

Audio Gear Talk
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That’s exactly what I wanted to know. Not tied to a DAP, but I did not want to carry a laptop around from one room to another in the house, as I thought all the amp/ DAC required a connection to a computer via USB port. Whatever is to be used with the headphones, needs to be portable to be carried around with ease and always on.

I’ll look microRendu up. Don’t thing I can handle DIY stuff.

Since I am doing Roon, and so far I like it very much, I wish it is RoonReady. For future proof. MQA is also preferable, like the Onkyo DAP or the Pioneer DAP, or like the Meridian Explorer2 if I go that route (although I believe this needs to be connected to a computer, and not sure about separate amp).

So far, I am leaning towards Sennheiser HD 600 or 650, but not done by any means.

I have read good things about NAD Viso.

I love Oppo as a brand. Their BD players are great. I bough their new 203 UHD / 4K player recently. I read conflicting reports on their headphones though.

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Do you want multi-room, e.g., you have amps and speakers in multiple rooms that you want to stream to from Roon or Tidal? Or are you looking to walk around the house with a portable system and headphones? if the later, then a DAP is your best bet, no doubt.

Just to explain a little more about Roon, there are three components - the server, the endpoint, and the remote/controller. Each of these can run on a different device or they are can all run on a single PC or laptop. If you run them all on one device, then obvious the device is going to have to move from room to room. But if you want to do multi-room with Roon, there are lots of options. You can run Roon server on a desktop, on a NAS, or on a dedicated box like a Sonic Transport.The end points can be a PC, a Roon Ready DAC, or a device like the microRendu. A microRendu can make any existing DAC you own, Roon Ready. Roon already supports multi-room streaming and grouping zones. It also streams Tidal and Internet radio via Tidal. They are promising MQA. If you have music stored on a NAS or hard drive, Roon can discover and stream that too. So with Roon as the software combined with the appropriate hardware components, you can easily setup a whole house music system.

But if all you need is to be able to listen to headphones in any room in your house, you don’t have music stored on a NAS, and you don’t have multiple sound systems you want to feed simultaneously, you don’t need Roon. Get a DAP and a pair of headphones that fit your budget and you’re done. You can load up SD cards with downloaded music or stream from Tidal via their Android app. If Tidal ever releases an MQA enabled version of their Android app, you can even stream MQA. Currently, the only way to get MQA to play on a Pioneer/Onkyo DAP is to download MQA files onto an SD card and let Tidal unfold them or send them to an MQA enabled DAC for processing.

I hope this helps

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43

Good summary. I use the DAP in the same way, with the Pioneer I have 420GB of music on tap with inbuilt storage and 2x 200GB SD cards so a lot of music :-). And, as Karl says, you can use it as a Tidal device or as a roon end point and slightly reduced functionality control device.

The Onkyo is a higher level audio device but in my opinion the Pioneer is good enough to match up to sennheiser 650s, which is what I have :slight_smile:
I also have UE900 and etymotic 4p IEMs which are now mid priced but are good revealing sets and it is a real experience to listen to it through them all.
The sennheisers are open backed so strolling through the town house you will have to ensure that your family don’t mind you leaking! I have some momentums if I am listening in a mixed crowd and your Marshall’s would do the same job.

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Thanks Karl and Ged!

Great summary.

I am on a trial with Roon. I was able to get 30 day trial, so that it overlaps with the expected BluOS software update on 1/31 to become RoonReady.

I have Roon Core set up in an older laptop in the basement. That’s the only use of that laptop, and must remain static on basement. I have multiple copies of my ripped CD library (700+ CDs ripped in ALAC via iTunes). I have them in that laptop where Roon Core is installed, in a NAS attached to the router in the main level living room, and in another HDD connected to an Oppo 203.

In the basement, I have a completely separate HT system, 5.1.2 Atmos enabled, with Axiom Speakers, REL subwoofer, Denon receiver, a 65" Samsung KS8500 4K tv, and another 65" 1080P tv on top of the Sammy. A bunch of devices connected to the HT, such as TiVo Bolt+ and Roamio OTA, Apple TV , Xbox One S and Oppo 203.

Roon controller on my iPad works great with the Roon Core.

My main listening system is in the basement, comprised of Bluesound Node 2, ELAC Uni-fi UB5 speakers, SVS SB12 subwoofer, and Rotel integrated. For the moment , music is played via Node 2 only with no Roon involved. Node 2 pulls the music fine from the NAS, plus of course Tidal, including MQA.

I have a Bluesound Pulse on living room for casual listening. I have nothing on the bedroom.

I had no idea Tidal MQA is not compatible with Android and thus with Onkyo. MQA on Tidal works great through Node 2. I can tell the difference easily on MQA versions on Tidal vs. regular versions of the same album. Not sure if the versions I am playing on iPhone 6 via Tidal app are MQA or not. Anyway to tell?

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MQA on Tidal only works via the desktop app at the moment.

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You mean via Tidal own apps, right? It certainly works through my Bluesound Node 2 and its Tidal app. 100% sure. The challenge is to find the MQA capable albums, but this can be easily done by going to Tidal desktop app, Masters section under “what’s new”, and then favoriting those albums, which will then show up on my BluOS Tidal app under my favorites.

By the way, I looked up that MicroRendu device. It is above my price range considering that I would need a separate DAC, and only available through a handful of dealers online at full MSRP.

Is there a cheaper similar concept device, portable, micro PC and all?

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Sotm SMS-200, and cheaper. Or just a pi/odroid type device with good linear power supply will probably get you some/most of the way there, depending on your other kit.

It’s worth noting the microrendu doesn’t provide any galvanic isolation on the USB. I find I need the Intona with it. It also needs a good PSU.

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48

The DP-X1 isn’t roon ready, but it is an android device, so as long as the roon app can run it, it can be set up as an end point (by un-clicking the private zone tick) in the settings on the android app

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Matthew, can you explain more about where to find the Private Zone setting? I looked at the Android device settings and the Music app settings but I don’t see this setting in either. My Onkyo is not recognized by Roon when it is on my Wifi network or connected to a PC via USB. So I must be missing something in the setup.

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If I go into settings, then audio on my phone.

I see the default output as you phone name - e.g. mine is Nexus 6p. if you go to the little cog and click settings on the general tab you have the private zone tick box (if ticked, it means only the phone can control it’s output but if not it shows on all Roon controllers

51

Thanks, the Onkyo DP-X1 isn’t a phone and must not have the same settings. However, I figured it out.

To get the DAP to act as a Roon endpoint, you have to download and use the Roon Remote Android app on the DAP. Then in the Roon app, go into Audio setup, find the Onkyo as a connected device, configure its settings, name it, and save it. You can then select the DAP as a Roon Zone in the Roon Remote app and stream to it just like any other Roon Zone, via the Roon Remote/Controller. This gives you access to your stored library of music and Tidal.

You then have the option of listening to Roon in 1 of 3 ways: 1) from one of the two headphone outputs on the Onkyo, 2) if you select line output and connect a 3.5mm to RCA stereo cable to an amp, preamp, or integrated you can listen to the analog output from the Onkyo on your main system, or 3) you can use a USB OTG cable to feed a digital stream to an outboard DAC which can then analog output to any system of your choice.

This is basically what Ged was showing in his screen shots a couple of days ago but it took me a while to figure out how to do it. Duh!

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52

That what i was trying to get at Karl. Glad you’ve got it all working. Should make a pretty neat mobile endpoint

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Update (from the OP):

I ended up completing the purchases today. I picked up the following:

1 - Onkyo DP-X1

2 - Headphones: Hifiman EH-400i

I had the opportunity to audition a bunch of headphones, and settled on the Hifiman in great condition (used) for $280

Got the Onkyo brand new for $450 with a leather case added as a bonus.

Still setting up now, and may be able to post impressions tomorrow (Sunday)

BTW - Karl’s trick on using Onkyo as a player / end point on Roon works!

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Yes let us know how that goes. Really good deal on the Onkyo they are $600 equivalent in the U.K.

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[quote=“ged_hickman1, post:54, topic:18498, full:true”]
Yes let us know how that goes. Really good deal on the Onkyo they are $600 equivalent in the U.K.
[/quote]

OK, time for an update.

I set everything up last night, stayed after midnight. Tidal, Roon, and download the new Metallica album “Hardwired to Selfdestruct” in 24 bit FLAC just to try the internal Onkyo music player.

1 - Great sound from the built in player.

2 - I can definitely tell a difference on Tidal MQA albums. It has been mentioned here that Tidal would not play MQA from the Android app, but I hear better clarity on those MQA albums. Don’t know what to say, maybe just my (incorrect) perception.

3 - While was able to use DP-X1 as a player through Roon (thanks Karl!), it loses the connection during the playback way to often. Songs get interrupted.Uploading… Uploading…

DP-X1 shows as RAAT but the end point is not purple in the chain.

Maybe because I have yet to connect the PC where the Roon Core is installed via Ethernet.

4 - Since Onkyo has dual DACs and Amps and a Balanced output, and since Hifiman HE-400i comes Balanced-ready with no mods, I am looking to purchase a balanced cable. This has been proven challenging as they are hard to come by, and when found, very expensive, almost half the price of the headphones.

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I’m not 100% sure but I think this is $89 for an Onkyo to hifiman adapter cable or $110 for a Onkyo to hifiman connectors cable.

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I don’t have any problems streaming Roon to my DP-1X, so I suspect a network issue. If your Roon server is not hard wired, you may try that first. Also, see if you can create a separate Wifi network that uses a channel or frequency different than the rest of the devices in your home. I used to have similar problems with my Aries until I created an Aries only Wifi network using 5Ghz frequency.

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[quote=“ged_hickman1, post:56, topic:18498, full:true”]
I’m not 100% sure but I think this is $89 for an Onkyo to hifiman adapter cable or $110 for a Onkyo to hifiman connectors cable.[/quote]

Nope. It is this at $105:

I have been exchanging emails with SurfCables (super fast replies I got from them, and over the weeken!), Andy they pointed to this, saying:

The source (player is trrs) the headphones are trs or actually ts since r is not used. T= tip R=ring and S=sleeve.

The older hifiman units had screw in type jacks on them. Assuming you have the newer ones they just have a female socket with no threads.

Still, expensive! I will keep looking.

On another note somebody over at Head-fi forums said that DP-X1 putting 300 mW power at 32 Ohms in Balanced mode is not enough to drive the HE-400i. Hmmm…

59

When you guys use the Onkyo DP-X1 DAP as an endpoint are you finding it as a networked device or are you connecting it to the Roon core via USB?

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I use Hifiman HE-400i and HE-1000 together with a Pioneer XDP-100R, single ended. I use Variable LineOut of course and have yet to come across a song where volume and quality lacks…
Yes, of course a stationary headphone amp has got more grunt, but i have found an acceptable compromise here when it comes to portability, quality and versatility. Lots of y-words here… :wink: