Tidal and Local music keeps stopping (Sonos endpoints)

Thank you for touching base with me, @Dick_Cooper. I appreciate the follow up.

What the provided logs indicate to me is that the endpoints are losing connection to your Roon core, which is why my suggestions thus far have been to investigate “further down stream” as there were no issues when playing directly out of the core machine.

The proposed test should provide us with a good data point and I look forward to hearing your observations.

-Eric

I am trying your suggestion of bypassing the Netgear switch. I have the following plugged into the router:
1.Core PC
2.Connection to sitting room system, which goes to a Sonos Zoneplayer then a DAC then the Linn
3.NAS
4.Connection to my home security monitoring system (unwise to disconnect it - they get stressed)

I have just played the album that gave the problems before (Herskedal The Roc) without any problems. It would therefore point to the switch as the guilty party. I think it is a smart switch, so could it be downgrading the Roon data stream in a way that it does not downgrade the Sonos data ?

I am reluctant to replace the switch: it works just fine with Sonos, so it seems to me that it is a Roon problem. If there is no solution available I will just stop using Roon. Shame, but it is a lot of money for something that used to work but doesn’t now.

I hesitate to say this, but Tidal/Roon seems to be working perfectly again. I re-plugged everything back to how it used to be and have been playing music ever since. I really have no idea how this has happened. The system is the same as it used to be except that Windows 10 has had a lengthy upgrade on the core machine.

Eric: I will regard this as a dead issue, but of course I will raise a new issue if it breaks again !

Glad to hear things have stabilized here Dick.

My guess is that something in your environment isn’t consistently working like we would expect, and that this issue may come up after extended up time. If you’ve been unplugging and restarting network gear, that may be what is modulating the symptoms right now.

In any event, Eric and our team can work with you to figure out what’s going on here, if the issue recurs. It’s possible Roon is more sensitive to something unexpected happening in your environment, but whatever’s been going on, we’ll definitely be able to investigate this and get things stable.

Let us know how it’s going and thanks for your patience!

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I spoke too soon. The problem is back again! I now have my main system (sitting room) connected direct to the router, not via the switch. The music stops unpredictably via Roon, although it can be restarted where it left off. It plays without stopping via Sonos.

I know that I am not the only Roon user with this problem, so I hope you think of something soon. I am now on 1.4, build 298, 64 bit

Thanks for touching base with us @Dick_Cooper, sorry to hear that the behavior has reoccurred on your setup.

In light of your most recent report I am going to be enabling diagnostics on your account to help aide in our evaluation of this behavior you are experiencing. What this action will do is the next time Roon is active on your core machine a diagnostics report containing a set of your Roon logs will be automatically/generated uploaded directly to our servers. Once the report comes in I will confirm that it has been received and then swiftly pass it over to our tech team for analysis.

Additionally, since noting that this behavior has reoccurred have you by chance tried testing with the mentioned switch bypassed again to confirm if things stabilize? The reason I ask is because if the switch happens to be “managed” we have seen a few issues crop up with these devices in the past ( Example: #1, #2, #3) and recommending that flow control should be enabled on the device has helped others.

-Eric

Thanks again Eric. I will start Roon shortly. The switch may well be “the problem” ( see post up the page) but it is not, as I understand it, a “managed” switch". I have read that, as a smart switch, it is halfway to being managed. The only improvement I could make is that the core PC could be connected to bypass the switch. This still does not answer the basic problem which is that I can play an album perfectly through Sonos but not through Roon. As I have said before I like Roon features but if Roon doesn’t work properly I am not going to pay for it. I know that I am not the only person experiencing this problem, and given the strong position Sonos has in the market (shortly to announce an IKEA linkup, I hear) you really need to knock this on the head

Hi @Dick_Cooper ----- I just checked our servers and confirm that the latest diagnostics report has been received.

I will be updating your ticket with all of your latest feedback and then passing over to our techs for further investigation. Your patience is appreciated.

-Eric

Hi Eric. You will not get any reports for a week or so, because I am going on holiday. You will find reports for the last few days, showing that the service it still up to its old tricks: stopping mid track for no apparent reason. Let’s hope that the techs think of something.

Hi @Dick_Cooper —— Hope holiday has been enjoyable!

Moving forward, I touched base with our tech team yesterday in regard to the diagnostics report we received from your system. We are seeing traces in the logs that are showing general performance issues with the mentioned endpoints, similar to the traces you shared in your previous posts (i.e “disconnects” and “stoppages in playback”), but unfortunately nothing indicating the cause of these issues with the Sonos based endpoints.

In light of the above we have enabled extra debugging on your account which is geared specifically to Sonos devices. When you are home from your travels would you kindly please restart your core machine and reproduce the behavior once more. This action will trigger this feature we have enabled on your account. Our hope is that this action will provide more detailed insight into what is occurring with the endpoints in your setup.

Furthermore, being as you have experienced this behavior with both local content on the NAS and TIDAL content, my sense is that you are experiencing audio dropouts. I had a case some time ago where one of our users was experiencing numerous dropouts with their very high end audio setup and after much troubleshooting it was determined that their NAS had a failing drive in it which was causing the issue. The point being is that we must look into multiple variables to try and understand what could be having influence on the behavior being experienced. I mentioned earlier that testing with come local content on the core machine would be a good data point just to confirm how things respond with the NAS out of the way (temporarily). At your earliest convenience would you please perform the following test:

  • Move some content to the local storage of the core machine.
  • Launch the application and disable any watch folders being accessed via the NAS.
  • Setup a “test watch” folder in the application focusing on the content you moved to the internal storage of the core machine.
  • Confirm what playback is like with the NAS temporarily removed.

-Eric

Sorry for the delay Eric. I have copied some music to the local machine and will play it this afternoon. I have set up a watch folder without, to be honest, having any idea what it is ! I will be gardening this afternoon and will leave about 2 hours worth of music playing.

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As you will see Roon stopped halfway through the first album. I had even turned the NAS off to make sure it wasn’t interfering in any way !

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Thanks for reaching out to me @Dick_Cooper and sharing the observations you made during the proposed test. The insight is very appreciated!

As mentioned in my previous, the extra debugging was active on your account and based on the diagnostics report that we have received I can see from the log traces that the adjustment took, so I am going to be updating your ticket and passing back over to our techs for review.

Additionally, I wanted to see if you could recall the name of the album that stopped halfway through playback so I can add that to your ticket as well. Having that information will help expedite the log analysis.

-Eric

The album that stopped was Acoustic Ladyland - Camouflage.

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Thanks @Dick_Cooper!

-Eric

I have heard nothing from you, so I assume there has been no progress. Is there anything I can do to help ?

I thought/hoped that build 300 might have improved things. Unfortunately not.

Hi @Dick_Cooper ---- Thank you for your patience and my apologies for the slow response.

To offer a quick update, this issue has been with our tech team who have been vigorously trying to reproduce this issue in our QA lab so we can have a better understanding of what could potentially be causing this behavior to occur. This has been quite the challenge for the team as our attempts to reproduce the problem in house have had mixed/varying results. As you are aware, in order for us to address the issue we must first be able to replicate it.

Part of the challenges we are facing stem from the fact that everyone has a different network configuration with a varying amount of devices being implemented (routers, switches, powerline adaptors, etc). So pinpointing the variable(s) that could be influencing the performance of our Sonos integration has been quite arduous. Our plan is to set up some field testing in an environment where the issue can easily be replicated.

-Eric

You are very welcome to stay with me here in France and check the system. I can offer you accommodation in what is the gastronomic centre of northern France, including one of only 2 Michelin 2-star restaurants north of Paris. It is about 2 hours from Paris, depending on your airport. See www.cooper363.fr for my house. I appreciate that this would be an expensive, although enjoyable, fact-finding trip, but I also know that you have a number of calls on this issue. I, for one, will not be continuing to subscribe unless the issue is resolved, so maybe it makes business sense to come over and see me.

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Having read loads of posts on this Roon/Sonos issue I am now trying something different: I have told Sonos to use the Wifi from my router, not the Sonos WiFi. I will let you know how we get on. Eric: you will, I believe, be able to see the log from this afternoon (March 2, starting at about 1320.)