Title and Composition issue

Core Machine (Operating system/System info/Roon build number)

QNAP TVS-871Firmware 4.4.3.1400 Roon Server 2020-07-15 (test period is running)

Audio Devices (Specify what device you’re using and its connection type - USB/HDMI/etc.)

Linn Majik DSM via LAN-cable

Description Of Issue

You can select if you want to have the roon-title or the title from the file for the album and the titles. But this doesn’t work if there are multi-part titles:

I have maintained my titles with the original title (intended by the composer). In this case the title of this composition should be:
Sonate Nr. 1 f-Moll Op. 2 Nr. 1

I have read a lot of threads in the forum about this topic and have not found any solution to my problem.

So the next try was to remove the grouping in Roon at all and show the original title, but I do not find any setting to ignore compositions at all. You can only add compositions.
My track-names are build like this: Sonate Nr. 1 f-Moll Op. 2 Nr. 1 • 1. Allegro

if the CD is not recognized, the composition would be like this:
Sonate Nr. 1 f

  1. Moll Op. 2 Nr. 1 • 1. Allegro
    You see: the break is done at the “-”, but this is not mentioned in the settings. Proposal:
    Compare the first letters until to the first difference and take this as name of the composition. Ignore the mainained seperators like “•”.

Last question:
I have found the meta-data description in your online-help https://kb.roonlabs.com/Metadata_Model
Is there any chance, if I add to my files your tags, that they will be taken? (this would also fix my first problem: I would then maintain it via yate.)

Thank you for your help in advance.

Best Regards,
Cosmic

Hi @Cosmic_Encounter,

You can use WORK and PART tags in your file tags to change this. Once you’ve added the tags click the 3 dots, choose Edit Album, and under metadata preferences choose file tags for composition grouping.

Yes, That is correct. There are several feature requests to make this behaviour more consistent so that it is possible also to edit the titles of multi-part works. A common use case would be for transcriptions where the instrumentation has changed and the canonical titles no longer make any sense.

I have maintained my titles with the original title (intended by the composer). In this case the title of this composition should be:
Sonate Nr. 1 f-Moll Op. 2 Nr. 1

Roon is not using the composition titles as originally published. With major composers I wouldn’t have thought many were, especially those that have been catalogued, sometimes several times. Instead roon is using canonical titles devised by its metadata supplier Tivo/Allmusic. You can usually see what those are on the allmusic.com site.

If you consistently apply these canonical titles, the advantage is that roon can identify at a composition level (not just album) and group together all your performances of a composition, regardless of who the performer was or which album release or compilation box-set they appear on.

If you really want to use your own titles, you will then have to “un-identify” them, usually by un-identifying the album. But then you will lose much of the value of roon as a Classical music organiser. But you may still prefer that as roon also gives you ease of physical networking of audio devices.

I have maintained my titles with the original title (intended by the composer). In this case the title of this composition should be:
Sonate Nr. 1 f-Moll Op. 2 Nr. 1

Roon is not using the composition titles as originally published. With major composers I wouldn’t have thought many were, especially those that have been catalogued, sometimes several times. Instead roon is using canonical titles devised by its metadata supplier Tivo/Allmusic. You can usually see what those are on the allmusic.com site.

If you consistently apply these canonical titles, the advantage is that roon can identify at a composition level (not just album) and group together all your performances of a composition, regardless of who the performer was or which album release or compilation box-set they appear on.

[/quote]
Thank you for the answer. I do not understand why to use the English title of a German or French composition. If it was intended by the composer use another language they used the Italian, French or German title ( Russian composers did it often add this other languages to their Russian title). Please have a look to the Urtext and you will see directly the difference to allmusic.com). But I understand your point with the consistency of the whole collection: if you do it wrongly, it will be 2 different compositions.

At least the ungrouping feature was new to me.

Many thanks. I used this tags, they are shown on the tag detail screen:


I selected title preference:

In the composition, too:

But roon ignores it, because my “file does not have this data”. Do I use the wrong Tags?

If the composition is identified and if it is multi-part then, yes, roon will ignore your file composition title tag. This is just how roon works. There are feature requests to change this behaviour going back several years but no change as yet.

There is no combination of settings which will give you what you want. It is better to accept this is how roon works.

Occasionally, I “un-identify” an album so I can force roon to use my own tags but that is usually because the “identified” version is a mess with many errors from the meta-data suppliers. This is not really a general solution, just a work-around where an unidentified album gives better results than an identified album.

thx a lot for your answer. I will see how I will handle it…