Valley of "audiophile" ethernet cables

It’s certainly not cut and dry. You can have a shielded cable that isn’t tied at either end. The use for that is many cables in a bundle from affecting each other. The switch or router wouldn’t matter in that scenario.

Y.W. :slight_smile:

Hopefully you didn’t need Adobe Creative Suite with the latest edition of PhotoShop to see those tabs :stuck_out_tongue:

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Keep in mind the shielding is to reject RFI that is ABOVE 30 MHZ. Something, while not impossible, is highly improbable in the home environment. I think you would be fine with UTP cabling.

Another FYI: CAT5E has been around since 2002. Netgear even has a 10G (1250MB a second) switch that can do 148 feet of CAT5e. That’s 1200, 24/192 PCM / WAV files concurrently. Or think of it this way:

2 CD’s every second. I have 2000 in my collection. My entire library could be transferred in 17 seconds over 14 year old CAT5e that cost $0.50 a foot.

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I had been using the D-Link DGS-1005 plastic switch. Yesterday, I picked up the metal D-Link DGS-108 with shielded jacks. Stock D-Link power supplies on both.

Speed has never been the problem since the ethernet system is closed and used only for Roon and the distances are minimal. I use Roon with an iMac desktop system. The audio gear is a meter away from the iMac on a rack. So unfortunately, I cannot have the ideal setup of having the computer in another room as the iMac is needed. Even if the Roon was on another computer in a room far away, the iMac would still be in use. So might as well run the Roon on the iMac. However, the iMac and other power supplies for the router and switch are plugged outside the Torus. All the audio gear on Torus isolation transformer. Stock 14 AWG shielded power cables for all the gear.

The three cables are 6a S/STP 1 feet, 5 feet and 7 feet long. Hardly challenging given the load and distance.

The 7 footer goes from the iMac to a Linksys E3000 router that has its wireless disabled along with other stuff. The Linksys doesn’t have shielded jacks. Then a 1 footer from the Linksys to the DGS-108. Then a 5 footer from the DGS-108 to the BDP-1. Both the DGS and BDP-1 have shielded plugs. So that’s the only shielded connection front to back in the chain. The DGS-108 has a ground screw at the back, however, I haven’t utilized that at the moment.

Anyways, it’s hard to conclusively say whether it’s the power supplies interaction or the airborne crap from the iMac in near proximity or both that might be affecting other gear. Not the most controlled setting.

I will say that having gone from the 5e and 6 UTP to 6a S/STP made a positive difference. Switching out the DGS-1005 to the DGS-108 also seems to have made a positive difference. Although, it’s been a day so I won’t reserve my impressions as final that came with the change in network switch.

I’ve tried many combinations with the routing and cabling and there has never been a difference on the BDP-1’s CPU’s readout. It holds steady at the same number for most part as expected.

The change in sonics that I experienced with ethernet tweaking follows roughly the same changes in sonics that I experienced when experimenting with the BDP-1 with hard drive storage in MPD. For example, powering a portable hard drive off the BDP-1 vs. a flash drive, or using an external hub, with or without a Jitterbug.

The improvement in clarity almost always seems to accompany changes in how deep or dynamic I think the bass feels. With noisy combinations, the bass seems flat and doesn’t go as deep. The benchmark for the worst was feeding the BDP-1 from a Powerline adapter. The high-end extension goes out the window. Bass goes flat and soundstage closes in. The tonality stays the same.

On the Amphions, I do find with vocals there is better phase accuracy. The phantom center holds more steady. As the system gets progressively ‘noisier,’ the image starts to deviate and has a bit of an artificial haze.

I do have an incoming Teradak U9 and a spare Jitterbug that I might try with the switch. Even if it doesn’t make any improvements directly or indirectly, I still think it’s a good idea to remove the stock switching away from the proximity of audio gear.

If the input voltage is 12V for your switches you could try a Linear Regulated 3 AMP supply and custom make a multi-lead cable that would power them all. That way ground is referenced for everything at the single power supply.

You are still doing this sighted and believe if your sighted bias is mitigated you may see all your impressions dissipate.

Has anyone here tried the “mod” that John Swenson describes here?

Seems an inexpensive way of reducing noise.

Only the router is 12V. Both the D-Link switches are 5V. Link to this “Linear Regulated 3 AMP”?

Yes, this has been sighted, and as such there will always remain the possibility that this may all be an auditory hallucination. LOL not everybody’s leaping at the idea of spending time assisting crouching behind a rack and switching ethernet cables and switches. :joy:

That’s why I won’t claim my impressions as a fact. Furthermore, I don’t have any measuring tools for this stuff to either support or refute my impressions.

From my own personal experiences, I have found the passage of time to be the best at reducing bias. Lots of time, I have either liked something or not liked something and then ended up changing my opinion 180 as I get used to it. If it’s simply a change in preference, that’s usually where I’m more skeptical with myself. However, with certain things where I am getting seriously fatigued frequently, that’s usually a more solid sign that something may not be right. I’m quite skeptical with myself and usually do try to listen for an extended time.

The biggest reason why I do trust myself after due process is that in over 95% of the cases, when I try something new or tweak something existing, I never end up experiencing things the way I would have expected them to go in my head. I’m always thrown off. Things never go as expected. It still might be expectation bias at play, but if it is, I have a terrible expectation bias implementation. It rarely ever goes in my favour. It would’ve been so much easier if expectation bias went my way. I genuinely do envy people that are always fond of every change and tweak that they make. :weary:

Anyways, at the end of the day, I’m a sample size of 1 in a less than optimum, controlled, and sighted configuration. So it’s probably best to exercise caution and skepticism.:thinking:

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You can get them on Amazon. They are dial a voltage lab/bench supplies. These units tend to price around $60 to $200 and generally have a high degree of regulation to ensure they maintain voltage.

Which ones are you talking about? Replying to who ?

One thing that I forgot to mention about the two switches is that besides having shielded ports on the DGS-108 and plastic on the DGS-1005G, the overall body of each of these units are also metal and plastic respectively. Not sure if that makes any impact with regards to leaked airborne noise in one or both directions? The switch and router are placed on the ground about half a meter away from the rack. When I swap out switches, I make sure to put them in the same place.

An article about ‘audiophile’ cables written from the inside -

Probable also applies to fancy schmancy $400 switches and $650 costume jewelry endpoints (you know, those ones with the special sauce).

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Quick question: Does anyone know the size of the DC barrel size (in mm) on the DGS-108?

http://www.dlink.com/fi/fi/products/-/media/images/products/dgs/108/dgs108b1image-lback.png

I’m looking to get a USB to DC cable. Thanks.

I would send D-Link an email or see if it is referenced in their support documentation.

I had an online chat with their support team and they didn’t know it. I checked all literature and it wasn’t specified. I emailed them. Hopefully, they do get back.

I’m going to guess it’s 2.5mm

T.I.'s white paper on “Reducing Radiated emissions in 10/100 lan cabling” covers a lot of ground and backs what you are saying:

Ground loop via Ethernet cabling is a dog that doesn’t hunt AND the Achilles heal of networking is the single ended nature of the power supply. But that has nothing to do with the cabling and everything to do with the PSU.

Good replacement PSU’s are $30.

I recently did this with my AM radio as well just for kicks with all of my gear: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ofN1EsZVoGY

2009 27" iMac, Class D Amphion amp, Torus 15, Dangerous Music Source, Bryston BDP-1, Teradak 12V13A, 2 switches and their stock switching power supply, router + stock PS.

I tested it with the entire rig powered up as well as with individual gear powered up ONLY.

It was eye opening to BOTH see and hear the interference patterns from these devices. Some dead quiet. Others barely audible. Others were a crap shoot. You could actually hear the interference pattern change as the power load on the power supplies increases and decreased. Besides noise patterns, it was also interesting to see the impact of distance and the radius of these products.

I finally heard back from D-Link regarding their DC barrel size:
thumbnail_c92ae4d01598478d806e5ccbfc1b0335

Hi Joel,

What are you doing with respect to grounds? Is your switch/router grounded? Are you floating the ground on one end or both?

Loving this thread, It makes me chortle so much at what an audiophile will spend for perceived audio Nirvana.

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Go to a gig, then look at the cables lol But if it’s any good,(The gig, that is) you’ll get the best sound ever…