Value of audiophile network switches

Why do you equate expectation bias with audible experience ?

Iā€™ll go out on a limb a little bit here I guess - audiophiles should generally leave network hardware well alone unless they really understand what theyā€™re doing. I mentioned it in another post on network cables. Besides categories of cable, which, for the data bandwidth required for audio, are totally irrelevant anyway, there are three main types of cable - UTP, FTP and STP.

Thereā€™s no need for anything other than UTP cabling in a home setup. FTP and STP cables are designed, in conjunction with the appropriate, earthed, networking infrastructure, for use in harsh environments subject to high levels of EMI. Think along the lines of network control gear in factories where thereā€™s a high degree of electrical pollution and mains harmonics caused by motors, variable speed drives etc. etc.

Mixing cables in a system is a very bad idea as you risk creating groundloops. The standards (ANSI/ISO/IEC) require that you utilise a consistent approach all the way through an installation, including all the hardware and cabling.

If in doubt, leave your networking installation to a professionalā€¦

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I donā€™t always, but in digital networking, where the engineering and science say otherwise, changes in ā€œaudibleā€ experience are due to other factorsā€¦

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Observing (as in listening) and noting the findings of others (no doubt based on their listening experiences) is subject to all the problems weā€™ve already discussed, but Iā€™d be interested to hear your take on the science you mention.

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I can pretty much say with certainty that recreating the same sound exactly (measurably so or not not) is going to be much outside the scope of even the most stringent of environments due to changes in air density, temperature, humidity, external vibrarion etc etc such that nobody could possible say that 2 sounds were ever the same.

Our brains are wonderful things but are easily fooled by such minuscule differences from one moment in time to another whether comparing sound, sight, smell, touch or just about any other emotion or sensation.

There is no right or wrong hereā€¦if you want to try something different do so, but donā€™t drag others into the this is this and that is that - we all have a mind to decide and believe in what we want.

Iā€™m with you in sentiment - freedom of choice etc - but there are some pretty deleterious consequences to encouraging people to believe what they want, simply because they can. Itā€™s not a huge issue for hifi - less money in the bank, and thatā€™s about it - but as a general rule of thumb Iā€™d encourage people to be a bit more rigorous in formulating their beliefs.

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Only in good manner and not to be too offensive, looking at blooming market of audiophile switches worldwide you are failing to fulfil your mission.

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That said, you canā€™t stop themā€¦ :wink:

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I think youā€™re probably doing a disservice to people of faith with that statement, but I know what youā€™re trying to say. And in part I agree: thereā€™s more to human existence than strict objectivism permits, but it seems like a decent place to start when discussing network switches (infinitely less complex than human beings, donā€™t have feelings, etc etc).

Oh, and in case you overlooked it ā€¦

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This cable should be a winnerā€¦I think Iā€™ll get one for my raspberry pi hahahahaha might need some cable lifters - anyone got anything to recomend?

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For a cable of such obvious quality I suspect you need a dozen of these, minimum :wink:

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Ā£798.00 each! :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:

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Money talksā€¦Itā€™s not a lie.

I heard it onceā€¦It said goodbye!

As to the ā€œvalue of audiophile network switchesā€ if you can afford the high end options lucky you.

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Iā€™ll stick with my bargain DellX1052P that I got for a measly Ā£203.97 on ebay!

Thank You David. I had fun following Your suggestion.

Installed SoX on my VitOS, copied redbook format WAV files to /tmp
AUDIODEV=plughw:0,0 play -V test.wav

On my headphone setup, I can not distinguish playing from my RasPiā€™s RAM or from my Roon Coreā€™s internal HDD via ethernet. So no improvement to be expected from tinkering with network hardware.

On the other hand, while playing from RAM I am missing Roonā€™s DSP features.
Upsampling PCM, Converting to DSD? Not so. But clearly crossfeed and absolutely convolution filters.

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This result is as I would expectā€¦but quick question: Did you unplug the Ethernet cable after starting playback from RAM? Thatā€™s necessary to completely rule out potential improvement from tinkering with network hardware.

Thanks for sharing your results!

Oops! My fault. Thanks for the hint. Will repeat.

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Repeated. Same result. I can not hear any difference with ethernet cable plugged in or unplugged.

A fibre optic connection from my ROCK switch in the basement to my VitOS switch on the 2nd floor may or may not help in this regard.

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As with everything in audio YMMV, just want to share my personal experience since a lot of people commented without any experience. I went from a ubiquiti edgerouter which I got from work after detecting lost packets with the Comcast furnished router during online gaming sessions and wanting to improve latency. The network was stable and well sorted out for at least a year before adding the etherregen to the signal chain going to an sotm sms200. The difference is very small but definitely detected something was different as soon as it was plugged in, it took me a couple of days of long a/b comparisons to find exactly what I was hearing. Initial impression was negative towards the etherregen, it sucked some life out of music with slightly less sharp transients. After putting the old switch directly to the sms I detected some harshness which I guess i was used to, ended up keeping it in the system as it did more good than harm IMO.
Itā€™s likely system dependent but I would urge anyone interested to try, whatā€™s the point of living otherwise!
No need to be rich or wanting to piss money away, just buy used at a decent price and you can resell for 10% loss or less if it doesnā€™t work out.

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I was given an English Electric switch FOC, I had a listening session first then I replaced my cheap Cisco SG108D with it and repeated the listening session, I heard no difference either good or bad, I will keep it but I am glad I didnā€™t purchase it!
Did the fact I didnā€™t pay for it change my expectation biasā€¦ a whole other can of wormsšŸ¤­
System is Microrendu to Holo Spring L3 dac to Copland valve amp to Sonus Faber Guarneri Evolution speakers.

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